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perspexorange  
#301 Posted : 23 August 2020 11:31:36(UTC)
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Great detective work from you and your colleague.
Mystery fully solved now.

Great stuff!
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ROCKET MICK on 23/08/2020(UTC)
Debaser  
#302 Posted : 24 August 2020 03:29:55(UTC)
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He's doing the rounds.
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ROCKET MICK on 24/08/2020(UTC), Fotz on 24/08/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#303 Posted : 24 August 2020 12:10:43(UTC)
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Thanks for heads up, Debaser.Just listened.Pretty good and i was quite successful in grabbing a good quality audio capture.
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ROCKET MICK on 25/08/2020(UTC)
perspexorange  
#304 Posted : 25 August 2020 00:42:38(UTC)
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Thanks Debaser. Was able to download the audio too.
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ROCKET MICK on 25/08/2020(UTC)
M1  
#305 Posted : 26 August 2020 01:07:28(UTC)
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What are people's experiences with the NO store like? I finally plumped for the Movement box set a week ago but the status seems to permanently be 'packing', not dispatched, and they don't reply to messages. Not impressed.
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ROCKET MICK on 26/08/2020(UTC)
perspexorange  
#306 Posted : 26 August 2020 09:26:29(UTC)
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I had a bit of an issue with the 'Closer' package. But that was mainly due to the courier used (Royal Mail). They seemed to dispatch in time (or, at least, that's what it said on their website). It just took about a week to get here.

I must be a glutton for punishment, as I've ordered PC&L through them. Fingers crossed that, due its price, they'll opt for a better courier.
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ROCKET MICK on 28/08/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#307 Posted : 26 August 2020 09:52:34(UTC)
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I can't recall any major issues with the NO store but i struggle to remember what i bought from there and what i bought from Amazon.Think i bought the Music Complete vinyl box set from NO store back in 2015 and it arrived on time although i think it was delayed because of production issues rather than a problem with the NO store's delivery.Same i think with the People On The Highline limited edition 7" picture disc in 2016, delayed because of production issues rather than the NO store's delivery.

Think i bought the Ceremony green sleeve reissue in 2019 through the NO store and it arrived on time.

Oh and every Christmas i keep meaning to buy some of those New Order Christmas tree baubles but never get round to it.If they're available again this Christmas i really must try and grab some from the NO store.
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ROCKET MICK on 28/08/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#308 Posted : 31 August 2020 11:58:04(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post
Another reference is Dec's Heaven to Heaven book that also makes no mention of it in the set. He probably also taped the gig.


I didn't think to check this.

That book is superb! One of my favourite New Order items I own.

Yeah - it seems likely that Dec taped this.



Dug my copy of Heaven To Heaven out and have been re-reading a lot of it over the last day or two.Don't think i'd even looked at it for a number of years.Incredible book. those transcripts of Dec talking to the band in the dressing room after many gigs in the early 80s i found a great read again.

Hadn't remembered but his transcripts of between song banter from Barney and Hooky at the Kilkenny gig i now realise some parts were edited out of the Radio 1 broadcast.Wonder if they'd they've made it onto the DVD???....

Fantastic book and i by chance met Dec outside the Birmingham Ballroom 29.04.2012 gig when i was in the queue.He was giving flyers out for his book and when i realised it was him i told him i already had a copy of his book and was honoured to tell him what an amazing piece of work he'd created with Heaven To Heaven.
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC), Mark on 03/09/2020(UTC)
perspexorange  
#309 Posted : 31 August 2020 12:39:22(UTC)
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I once asked Dec, via Facebook, if he'd ever thought of publishing 'From Heaven To Heaven' as an eBook.
He said he'd like to do it, but it wasn't in his immediate future.

I would love to be able to read the book on my iPad. The physical tome is hefty, so not ideal for bedtime reading. Also, I'm a little scared of damaging it.

I think it would be good for it to get a digital release, as there must be a load of fans who've never seen this glorious book.
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#310 Posted : 31 August 2020 13:22:38(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post
I once asked Dec, via Facebook, if he'd ever thought of publishing 'From Heaven To Heaven' as an eBook.
He said he'd like to do it, but it wasn't in his immediate future.

I would love to be able to read the book on my iPad. The physical tome is hefty, so not ideal for bedtime reading. Also, I'm a little scared of damaging it.

I think it would be good for it to get a digital release, as there must be a load of fans who've never seen this glorious book.


Yeah it's a pretty heavy book, physically i mean obviously.I struggle at times also to read some of the text, don't know if it's the text is small in places or if it's because it's black on grey in some parts (the dressing room transcripts bits) and my eyesight isn't the best.Have to illuminate the text with the light on my phone at times to read it clearly.Maybe an ebook version would be good so i could zoom in more.How many copies were there printed? My signed copy by Dec "To John.The coolest of road trips! Best, Dec" also has the numbered sticker in bottom right stating it's number 542 out of 750.Were there only 750 copies printed? Or is that 750 figure just the number of signed copies Dec did? I know there was an earlier limited edition run with a silver(?) cover and some different pics from the version that i have and that copies were printed in a larger amount of the version i have.So if it reaally was only 750 copies made then yes, there must be a lot of fans who don't have a copy.
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
M1  
#311 Posted : 31 August 2020 14:09:25(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: M1 Go to Quoted Post
What are people's experiences with the NO store like? I finally plumped for the Movement box set a week ago but the status seems to permanently be 'packing', not dispatched, and they don't reply to messages. Not impressed.


Two weeks now, no update, status still 'packing'. No reponses to emails or on FB. Boo.

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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
perspexorange  
#312 Posted : 01 September 2020 08:16:22(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: M1 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: M1 Go to Quoted Post
What are people's experiences with the NO store like? I finally plumped for the Movement box set a week ago but the status seems to permanently be 'packing', not dispatched, and they don't reply to messages. Not impressed.


Two weeks now, no update, status still 'packing'. No reponses to emails or on FB. Boo.



I feel your pain. Frown

That must be very frustrating.
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
negative1  
#313 Posted : 01 September 2020 11:54:18(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: steinomite Go to Quoted Post
What's up with "Blue Monday" not having a die cut sleeve? Surely Warners has more money to blow than Factory did.

-Mike



well, at least the GIF has it :

UserPostedImage

this is from the email they sent out.

later
-1
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#314 Posted : 01 September 2020 13:42:30(UTC)
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Wow , Gideon Coe on 6Music just now played one of the versions of Thieves Like Us from the box set. Think he said it’s one of the writing session ones. Only a couple of minutes long but sounded great. Quite funky and slightly different bass sequencer (?) backing driving the track along . Same synth melody as released version but a different synth sound. Was played about 1 hour 35 mins into the show.Think you can rewind the live show on BBC Sounds right now or on catch up after the show finishes at midnight.

Edited by user 01 September 2020 13:43:16(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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perspexorange on 02/09/2020(UTC), Debaser on 02/09/2020(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
perspexorange  
#315 Posted : 02 September 2020 03:02:22(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
Wow , Gideon Coe on 6Music just now played one of the versions of Thieves Like Us from the box set. Think he said it’s one of the writing session ones. Only a couple of minutes long but sounded great. Quite funky and slightly different bass sequencer (?) backing driving the track along . Same synth melody as released version but a different synth sound. Was played about 1 hour 35 mins into the show.Think you can rewind the live show on BBC Sounds right now or on catch up after the show finishes at midnight.


Wow! Just listening now.

Sounds excellent!

C'mon 02/10/20. Get here already!

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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
Debaser  
#316 Posted : 02 September 2020 04:10:06(UTC)
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So just 2 minutes long, from 1hr33 to 1hr35. Not as good as the finished article, but a nice bit of fan-bait. I imagine if you're outside the uk you need a VPN. Anyway here's a link:
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
negative1  
#317 Posted : 02 September 2020 06:17:24(UTC)
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sounds good. you can hear the early themes, and chord work being done.

very primitive though.

later
-1
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#318 Posted : 02 September 2020 06:30:02(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Debaser Go to Quoted Post
So just 2 minutes long, . Not as good as the finished article, but a nice bit of fan-bait.


I quite liked it.Promising ideas in it, much but not all of which made it to the final cut.It had a much funkier feel than the finished version, especially the bass synth/sequencer thing whatever the technical name is.And interesting to hear the intro without any Hooky bass.

Gideon Coe seemed to say the demo was from 1982 so either he got the year wrong or NO actually had ideas and a demo for the song as early as that???.....

Edited by user 02 September 2020 06:41:17(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
50poundnote  
#319 Posted : 02 September 2020 07:10:37(UTC)
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It's not uncommon for a band to sit on a song idea for a while until something clicks. One of the first songs Pet Shop Boys wrote was Jealousy, which didn't appear until their 4th studio album (and was their 17th "proper" single).
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
Mr Discography  
#320 Posted : 02 September 2020 07:39:43(UTC)
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Are any of the box set versions of 'Thieves' recorded with Arthur Baker present? He's down as a co-writer, but the single version doesn't seem to have been produced by him. Wondered if there's a version they made with him?
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#321 Posted : 02 September 2020 10:38:27(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: 50poundnote Go to Quoted Post
It's not uncommon for a band to sit on a song idea for a while until something clicks. One of the first songs Pet Shop Boys wrote was Jealousy, which didn't appear until their 4th studio album (and was their 17th "proper" single).



Oh absolutely, of course.I've read many times of bands or artists recording a song they wrote years ago or many albums before.I just always assumed New Order though didn't start to create ideas for Thieves until sometime into 1983.But maybe the box set details will tell us.
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
Johnny James  
#322 Posted : 02 September 2020 21:52:19(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
Are any of the box set versions of 'Thieves' recorded with Arthur Baker present? He's down as a co-writer, but the single version doesn't seem to have been produced by him. Wondered if there's a version they made with him?


Yes, and that demo is on the box (New York demo #1). They started TLU with Arthur at the same time as doing Confusion in NY, hence co-writer. Once they came back with this very stripped down idea they reworked it into the track you know. The one played on the radio is part of that rewriting process.

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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
perspexorange  
#323 Posted : 03 September 2020 00:40:59(UTC)
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This sounds really interesting and am looking forward to hearing it.

I'm glad that Arthur was involved with the song from the start.

I've always thought it was a bit odd for Stephen Hague to have a writing credit for 'True Faith', 'World In Motion' etc., when it seems that he only got involved during the recording process.
At least with Baker, it does appear that he was pretty heavily involved in the germination of the song.

I'm not trying to diminish the important role of the producer, but I'm just not sure how much 'writing' Hague did on the songs he's credited on.
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ROCKET MICK on 03/09/2020(UTC)
Mr Discography  
#324 Posted : 03 September 2020 02:04:25(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
Are any of the box set versions of 'Thieves' recorded with Arthur Baker present? He's down as a co-writer, but the single version doesn't seem to have been produced by him. Wondered if there's a version they made with him?


Yes, and that demo is on the box (New York demo #1). They started TLU with Arthur at the same time as doing Confusion in NY, hence co-writer. Once they came back with this very stripped down idea they reworked it into the track you know. The one played on the radio is part of that rewriting process.

Really interesting - looking forward to hearing these. Johnny, a couple of previous questions reposted that you may have missed earlier in this thread:
Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post

I had no idea of this. Do you know how they differ?

The Beach was missing some edit sections that should have been inserted, that includes the outro bit.

Are these sections that were edited into the original 12" version of 'The Beach' included in the 'Instrumental Outtake' version on the Definitive Edition, or was there another version of 'The Beach' mixed down (a bit like how the released 'Thieves Like Us Instrumental' is a combined edit of two different mixdowns)? If there were two different mixdowns of 'The Beach', which was was "Take 1", and which "Take 2"?
Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post

Murder has a longer drum intro at the beginning that should have been trimmed.

Having heard this longer drum intro on the Collector's Edition CD2, it made me wonder why they clipped the start on the original 12" version, as the unedited version has drums that start on the beat - whereas the 12" starts on an offbeat and always felt like it kind of 'tripped over' into the beat a little when it started. Wonder why they removed those first few seconds originally?

Cheers!




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ROCKET MICK on 06/09/2020(UTC)
Johnny James  
#325 Posted : 03 September 2020 03:25:43(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post

Are these sections that were edited into the original 12" version of 'The Beach' included in the 'Instrumental Outtake' version on the Definitive Edition, or was there another version of 'The Beach' mixed down (a bit like how the released 'Thieves Like Us Instrumental' is a combined edit of two different mixdowns)? If there were two different mixdowns of 'The Beach', which was was "Take 1", and which "Take 2"?


It's just a whole take, no extra bits edited into it. The bits were along the lines of added FX, so I guess they're not there on this one. I can't remember which take was what without searching about.

Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post

Murder has a longer drum intro at the beginning that should have been trimmed.

Having heard this longer drum intro on the Collector's Edition CD2, it made me wonder why they clipped the start on the original 12" version, as the unedited version has drums that start on the beat - whereas the 12" starts on an offbeat and always felt like it kind of 'tripped over' into the beat a little when it started. Wonder why they removed those first few seconds originally?


I've no idea, we just wanted to recreate the original. A question for Steve I reckon.
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ROCKET MICK on 06/09/2020(UTC)
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