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perspexorange  
#26 Posted : 02 February 2021 07:41:36(UTC)
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Wow! That's a really nice collection.
A Full House of New Order and a bonus JD one.
Yours look in great condition too. Both cards complete for PC&L. Fab stuff.

Substance appears to be the only one showing any sign of age, although it's definitely in much better condition than most copies, it seems.

Again, it prescribes to the theory that Substance was made of slightly different materials than the others, or, possibly has just been handled by fans more.

Did you buy yours from new, second-hand or a combination of both?



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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
negative1  
#27 Posted : 02 February 2021 07:53:29(UTC)
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thanks for the responses and great pictures everyone.

does anyone listen to these cassettes, or are they just for show.

i've never listened to any of them, or opened up the boxes more than twice now. once when i bought them.

and now to take a picture of what was inside.

did people actually send the postcards.



later
-1
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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
Fotz  
#28 Posted : 02 February 2021 19:34:17(UTC)
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No I never listen to them anymore. Probably did back in the day in the 80s, last time I would’ve played one would probably have been in the 90s sometime.Can’t even remember now where the full length TPK and Kiss of Death featured on the Low Life cassette.Was the full length TPK after Sunrise at the end side one? And then the Kiss of Death and Perfect Pit after Face Up at the end of side two? Think It was something like that.
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negative1  
#29 Posted : 02 February 2021 19:58:52(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
No I never listen to them anymore. Probably did back in the day in the 80s, last time I would’ve played one would probably have been in the 90s sometime.Can’t even remember now where the full length TPK and Kiss of Death featured on the Low Life cassette.Was the full length TPK after Sunrise at the end side one? And then the Kiss of Death and Perfect Pit after Face Up at the end of side two? Think It was something like that.



https://www.discogs.com/...-Low-life/release/114331



New Order ‎– Low-life
Label:
Factory ‎– Fact 100c
Format:
Cassette, Album
Box Set
Country:
UK
Released:
1985
Genre:
Electronic
Style:
Synth-pop
Tracklist
A1 Love Vigilantes
A2 The Perfect Kiss
A3 This Time Of Night
A4 Sunrise
A5 The Perfect Kiss (Fac 123)

B1 Elegia
B2 Sooner Than You Think
B3 Sub-Culture
B4 Face Up
B5 The Kiss Of Death
B6 Perfect Pit


later
-1
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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
perspexorange  
#30 Posted : 03 February 2021 01:09:03(UTC)
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I think I may have played Brotherhood (the first one I got) a handful of times and maybe Movement (the second tape I got) once or twice.

To be honest though, after my standard version of Substance getting chewed up, I learned a valuable lesson about playing tapes you considered ‘collectors items’.
Instead, I used to have copies of Movement / PC&L and Low Life / Brotherhood on two TDK SA-90s, and used these for my main listening pleasure.

I seem to think I had a standard version of Low Life on cassette too. It had a plain white cover (apart from the text of course).
Don’t think I risked that in my tape player very often either.
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negative1 on 03/02/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
GotBlueEyes  
#31 Posted : 03 February 2021 02:03:12(UTC)
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My Substance has also discoloured in a different way to the rest of the white New Order ones, and it is one that I had from brand new

I bought Substance on normal cassette (in the fat double cassette box version) for all the extra b-sides, but it got chewed within a couple of weeks, after non-stop play, so took it back
They only had the white linen box versions in stock by then so it was a good swap

I already had the Brotherhood one, which I got in the sale when RE Cords in Derby closed down

Then got Movement next from Virgin (when Virgin was a department in the local Debenhams!)

PCL & Low Life I picked up later in life when I started to collect the boxes. Got them all now, the Wim Mertens one being the hardest to get
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negative1 on 03/02/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
perspexorange  
#32 Posted : 03 February 2021 02:39:44(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: GotBlueEyes Go to Quoted Post
My Substance has also discoloured in a different way to the rest of the white New Order ones, and it is one that I had from brand new



Over the last couple of days, I've seen a few collections of tapes online. Substance, again, seems to have discoloured more than the others.

Originally Posted by: GotBlueEyes Go to Quoted Post

I bought Substance on normal cassette (in the fat double cassette box version) for all the extra b-sides, but it got chewed within a couple of weeks, after non-stop play, so took it back



I remember hearing once, back in the day, that the longer the tape, the more likely it was of getting chewed up. Not sure how true this is or the reason for this. It might be due to the additional weight of the reel with the extra tape on it or similar. It might just be down to the fact that a longer tape will be in a player for longer so, statistically speaking, it'll increase its chances of getting mangled.

If this is true, Substance, being considerably longer than most LPs, would be more susceptible to this.

Originally Posted by: GotBlueEyes Go to Quoted Post
Got them all now, the Wim Mertens one being the hardest to get


Congrats! Sounds like a fine collection! I'm pretty jealous. Smile
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negative1 on 03/02/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#33 Posted : 03 February 2021 02:41:17(UTC)
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Yeah, the cool thing about collecting is you pay through your hooter for stuff you never play cos you already bought it and don't wanna risk damaging.
I remember seeing these cassettes but I never had any money back then.
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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
Mr Discography  
#34 Posted : 03 February 2021 05:52:41(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post

I remember hearing once, back in the day, that the longer the tape, the more likely it was of getting chewed up. Not sure how true this is or the reason for this. It might be due to the additional weight of the reel with the extra tape on it or similar. It might just be down to the fact that a longer tape will be in a player for longer so, statistically speaking, it'll increase its chances of getting mangled.

If this is true, Substance, being considerably longer than most LPs, would be more susceptible to this.

For longer durations of cassettes, the tape needed to be thinner to fit in the cassette - that's why longer tapes like D120s used to split quite often.

The Substance B-side tracks total 94 mins, but because of track lengths, the music on side 1 of the tape is longer at 51 mins long - making the total length of the whole tape around 102 mins - and with 7-8 mins of silence after 1963 on side 2. I think it's the longest pre-recorded and released tape I ever owned. Mine never split, but got churned up about the second or third time I got to 1963, making it (and, in turn 'Procession' at the same point into the tape on side 1) sound crappy and muffled - so I bought a later release of it at a later date!

Edited by user 03 February 2021 05:56:49(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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GotBlueEyes  
#35 Posted : 03 February 2021 05:54:10(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post

I remember hearing once, back in the day, that the longer the tape, the more likely it was of getting chewed up. Not sure how true this is or the reason for this. It might be due to the additional weight of the reel with the extra tape on it or similar. It might just be down to the fact that a longer tape will be in a player for longer so, statistically speaking, it'll increase its chances of getting mangled.

If this is true, Substance, being considerably longer than most LPs, would be more susceptible to this.



Definitely this, I think they used to say it was because the tape is thinned out to make longer reels that still fit in the casing and not put additional weight strain on the cassette motors. But then if the tape jolts at any point as the motor strains, because it's thinner it's more likely to then have a loose section that gets caught in the pinch roller




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perspexorange on 03/02/2021(UTC), negative1 on 03/02/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
perspexorange  
#36 Posted : 03 February 2021 08:35:54(UTC)
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Thanks both.

It confirmed my suspicions.
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negative1 on 03/02/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
Fotz  
#37 Posted : 03 February 2021 08:50:37(UTC)
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Yeah I think that’s why Dec Hickey as he said in his book only used 60 minute tapes for recording gigs as, I guess other bootleggers also did. Less chance later on of the tape meeting a nasty and premature end.
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negative1 on 03/02/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
50poundnote  
#38 Posted : 03 February 2021 09:40:09(UTC)
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Yep, all 3 of my Factory / Substance / cassette #2 had/have issues. Old school heavy duty tape decks would wear them out after a while because the tape was too tight and/or heavy in the shell, and my modern cassette player doesn't have enough power to turn it.
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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
negative1  
#39 Posted : 03 February 2021 10:09:55(UTC)
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i am the most paranoid person ever. so that's why i never played those cassette tapes.

also, the commercial ones i did have were copied on a tape dubbing machine,
so i would never wear out the latter originals. (of course i had cheap US cassettes that I did wear out).

(not necessarily this model)
UserPostedImage

but later on i got smarter, and even bought Metal tapes for recording stuff from vinyl and other sources,
still have those and they sound great.

UserPostedImage


later
-1
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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
negative1  
#40 Posted : 03 February 2021 10:32:12(UTC)
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i would love to find this set:

https://www.discogs.com/...r-Retro/release/14854530
UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage


later
-1
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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
negative1  
#41 Posted : 03 February 2021 13:50:30(UTC)
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here's my small cassette collection : the new zealand blue monday one is harder to find, and maybe the world UK one with the exclusive mix on it.

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage


later
-1

Edited by user 03 February 2021 14:14:20(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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perspexorange  
#42 Posted : 03 February 2021 15:14:39(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: negative1 Go to Quoted Post
here's my small cassette collection : the new zealand blue monday one is harder to find, and maybe the world UK one with the exclusive mix on it.

UserPostedImage

UserPostedImage


later
-1


I have that FAC305c. A nice item, which seemed like a pretty cool thing for Factory to do at the time.

That was the first time I ever heard the Hague mix of BLT, which is my favourite mix of that song.

It also had a really nice (and rare) mix of ‘Big Bang’ by Revenge called ‘The Trouble With Girls’.


Which exclusive ‘World’ mix? Not sure I knew about that.
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Fotz  
#43 Posted : 03 February 2021 15:33:19(UTC)
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^ I think what negative means is there is an exclusive mix on the cassette but it’s not of World. it’s an exclusive mix of Vicious Circle, different from on the World CD single? I do have that World cassette single, will have to dig it out & listen to and check again on the Vicious Circle mix.It’s a different mix from the one on the CD single.I

Edit: oh hang on, I’m getting mixed up with the Ruined In A Day cassette single , so no I don’t know about an exclusive mix on the World cassette single ( which in fact I DON’T have)

Edit 2: Actually I DO have the World cassette single, just dug it out but it doesn’t have an exclusive mix on , it has the radio edit and Perfecto edit . Maybe the radio edit is exclusive?



I also have a few those above but not the Bue Monday New Zealand.I have the Select magazine Fac 305C cassette with the exclusive Hague mix of BLT

Here’s a selection of my NO, Electronic and Revenge cassettes. I have the Select mag 305C one too but it must be in another box upstairs somewhere.

UserPostedImage

Oh and also the Music Complete cassette that was in the Japanese box edition

UserPostedImage

Edited by user 03 February 2021 16:09:51(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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negative1  
#44 Posted : 03 February 2021 16:34:21(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
^ I think what negative means is there is an exclusive mix on the cassette but it’s not of World. it’s an exclusive mix of Vicious Circle, different from on the World CD single? I do have that World cassette single, will have to dig it out & listen to and check again on the Vicious Circle mix.It’s a different mix from the one on the CD single.I

Edit: oh hang on, I’m getting mixed up with the Ruined In A Day cassette single , so no I don’t know about an exclusive mix on the World cassette single ( which in fact I DON’T have)

Edit 2: Actually I DO have the World cassette single, just dug it out but it doesn’t have an exclusive mix on , it has the radio edit and Perfecto edit . Maybe the radio edit is exclusive?


sorry guys, i did mix it up, it was the ruined in a day cassette.

but the 'platinum on black' cassette, is what i should have been referring to:
https://www.discogs.com/...n-Black/release/13322818


Various ‎– Platinum On Black
Label:
FFRR ‎– 697 124 005-4
Format:
Cassette, Mixed
Country:
US
Released:
1993
Genre:
Electronic
Style:
House
TracklistShow Credits

B6 –New Order World 5:53

Total Time: 38:35


New Order World
Producer – New Order, Stephen Hague
Remix, Producer [Additional] – Paul Oakenfold & Steve Osborne
5:53

i haven't listened to it, so i think it's exclusive.

the cd, had the normal perfecto edit:
https://www.discogs.com/...m-On-Black/release/79058
New Order World (Perfecto Edit) 4:04

the US promo LP has the same timing:
https://www.discogs.com/...-On-Black/release/346926

New Order World (The Price Of Love) (Perfecto Edit) 5:53


all other versions have this:
World (The Price Of Love) (Perfecto Edit) 4:04



Quote:

I also have a few those above but not the Bue Monday New Zealand.I have the Select magazine Fac 305C cassette with the exclusive Hague mix of BLT

Here’s a selection of my NO, Electronic and Revenge cassettes. I have the Select mag 305C one too but it must be in another box upstairs somewhere.

UserPostedImage

Oh and also the Music Complete cassette that was in the Japanese box edition

UserPostedImage



yeah, i was going to post that cassette later one, because i found a few more new order ones.

later
-1

Edited by user 03 February 2021 16:42:19(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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Fotz  
#45 Posted : 03 February 2021 18:01:50(UTC)
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^ Ah ok, yes that 5.53 edit of the Perfecto mix isn't something i'm sure i've ever heard.The standard full length Perfecto is around 7.34 and as you state, the standard Perfecto edit indeed 4.04.
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Mr Discography  
#46 Posted : 04 February 2021 00:16:17(UTC)
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The Hague mix of BLT is also on the Married To The Mob soundtrack which I have on CD. Almost the same as the version on 'The Best Of' but has a little more reverb, and Barney's classic "Do do do do do do" vocal as lib after the first chorus - always wondered why Hague removed such a great bit of that version from his 94 'Best Of' version
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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
Mr Discography  
#47 Posted : 04 February 2021 00:17:48(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
^ Ah ok, yes that 5.53 edit of the Perfecto mix isn't something i'm sure i've ever heard.The standard full length Perfecto is around 7.34 and as you state, the standard Perfecto edit indeed 4.04.

Anyone confirmed the 5.53 timing of this version? Sometimes times are misstated on sleeves. Could be just another early fade I guess.
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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#48 Posted : 04 February 2021 00:25:30(UTC)
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Corporate pigs London spread the Ruined Bsides so you had to buy each format for an exclusive: Vicious Circles No mix (cassette), VC Haas and Ambient (CD), World dub (12"), three pieces of Pooh (CD 2). Each track was specially commissioned by London, each track was exclusive to its format, and each track was total and utter fucking shit.
The only decent thing to come out of that was the K-Klarse mix, which they must've liked cos it was used on TOTP, Radio 1's Top 40 and the Rest Of, though they also used the Ambient one at some 93 gigs.
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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
Fotz  
#49 Posted : 04 February 2021 00:46:30(UTC)
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^ I disagree agree with you Michael on your Vicious Circle opinion. I like both versions of it.
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ROCKET MICK on 11/02/2021(UTC)
perspexorange  
#50 Posted : 04 February 2021 00:54:30(UTC)
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It’s been years since I heard the NO version of Vicious Circle. This is the problem with putting something exclusive on a format that was dying out even back in 1993.
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