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perspexorange  
#1 Posted : 31 December 2021 08:36:22(UTC)
perspexorange

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As usual with one of my requests, this is a bit of a long shot.

I'm trying to compile a list of gigs which we know were filmed (at least partially). I was hoping to identify the person behind the camera for each of these and thought I could pull the credits from the two Definitive Editions and the Glasgow DVD.
However, looking at these, apart from a handful of shows (Hurrah's - Merrill Aldigheiri, Peppermint Lounge - Maureen Nappi, Pennies & Tolworth - Dec Hickey) there aren't really any details.

Most of them say that they are copyright Steve Morris but that's presumably mainly due to a lot of them being filmed on Steve's camera (I believe he used to enlist helpers to film the gigs).

So, if any knowledgeable fans happen to know who filmed the following, please let me know:

06/02/81 - CoManCHE Student Union, Manchester Polytechnic, Manchester, UK
20/06/81 - Glastonbury Festival, Worthy Farm, Pilton (Tony Wilson maybe?)
15/11/81 - Masonic Temple, Toronto, Canada
23/01/82 - Imperial Cinema, Birmingham, UK
11/03/82 - Soul Kitchen, Newcastle, UK
17/04/82 - Le Palace, Paris, France (Ged Duffy maybe?)
24/05/82 - Pennies, Norwich, UK (two cameras - Dec Hickey on the one, but who was on the other?)
17/06/82 - Piper Club, Rome, Italy
26/06/82 - The Haçienda, Manchester, UK
26/01/83 - The Haçienda, Manchester, UK
12/03/83 - Recreation Centre, Kingston-Upon-Thames, Tolworth, UK (two cameras - Dec Hickey on the one, but who was on the other?)
22/04/83 - Savoy, Cork, Ireland
24/04/83 - Rosehill Hotel, Kilkenny, Ireland
09/05/83 - Tower Ballroom, Birmingham, UK
29/06/83 - First Avenue, Minneapolis, Minnesota, USA
20/07/83 - The Haçienda, Manchester, UK
30/03/84 - Uni-Mensa, Düsseldorf, Germany
03/04/84 - Alabamahalle, Munich, Germany
08/04/84 - Metropol, Berlin, Germany
15/04/84 - Galactica, Luneburg, Germany
10/05/84 - Saga Cinema, Copenhagen, Denmark
04/08/85 - International Centre, Toronto, Ontario, Canada
15/12/85 - Rotterdam Arena, Rotterdam, Netherlands
14/06/89 - Shoreline Amphitheater, Mountain View, California, USA

All of these appeared on either of the two Definitive Editions, the Live in Glasgow DVD, the Factory Video or the Gorilla TV show that Steve did last year.
thanks 4 users thanked perspexorange for this useful post.
Like No Other on 31/12/2021(UTC), negative1 on 31/12/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 01/01/2022(UTC), In A Noisy Place on 06/01/2022(UTC)
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Johnny James  
#2 Posted : 03 January 2022 11:28:43(UTC)
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Dian Barton did quite a few I believe, using Steve's camera.
CoManCHE you can see AHW on one of the cameras, the other was probably either Malcolm or Brian.
The Hacienda 82 is credited at the end to Malcolm and Brian.
Hacienda July 83 was Trillion for RPM for Channel 4 (see credits on Play At Home).
Toronto was Paul Boyd (both of them).
Imperial Cinema was Ikon probably.
Rotterdam was an Ikon shot one (they actually showed that one at The Cornerhouse in July 86 as part of the 10th Summer stuff).
Minneapolis was the venue, as was Shoreline.
thanks 6 users thanked Johnny James for this useful post.
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perspexorange  
#3 Posted : 04 January 2022 01:14:15(UTC)
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Thanks for all this, Jenny. I was hoping you might be able to answer.

Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post
Dian Barton did quite a few I believe, using Steve's camera.


I noticed that she had done the Kilburn Ballroom footage.
I'm not very familiar with her. Was she a Factory person, or someone freelance? Maybe a friend of Steve's?

Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post

CoManCHE you can see AHW on one of the cameras, the other was probably either Malcolm or Brian.


Ah yes. Of course. I'd forgotten he was in the footage, camera in hand.

Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post

The Hacienda 82 is credited at the end to Malcolm and Brian.


I'm embarrassed to say that I'd completely forgotten about the end credits on some of the footage. I only checked the DVD case, Definitive Editions' books, Discogs entry etc.
Yep - it says that Malcolm and Brian Nicholson edited the footage, with Malcolm directing. It looks like Malcolm and someone called Linda Dutton operated the cameras. Again, any idea who she is?

Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post

Hacienda July 83 was Trillion for RPM for Channel 4 (see credits on Play At Home).


Ah yes. It also mentions a few people under the heading 'video camera' (Dave Swan, Barrie Dodd, Badger, Glen Wilkinson) straight after it mentions Trilion. I'm guessing that all of them worked for Trilion/RPM.

Mike Wilkie gets a separate 'film camera' credit, so presume he was the guy behind the camera for the main film (i.e. not the Haç gig).

Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post

Toronto was Paul Boyd (both of them).


I had a feeling it might have been him. Thanks for clearing this up.

Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post

Imperial Cinema was Ikon probably.



That would certainly make sense. I'll add IKON as 'tentative'.

Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post

Rotterdam was an Ikon shot one (they actually showed that one at The Cornerhouse in July 86 as part of the 10th Summer stuff).


Again, thanks for clearing that up. I didn't know it was shown separately. Interesting.

Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post

Minneapolis was the venue, as was Shoreline.


Great! I'll add that info to my list.


Again, many thanks for this. I'll go through the various credits of all the footage I have and see if there's anything I missed.
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Andy  
#4 Posted : 04 January 2022 11:06:47(UTC)
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perspexorange  
#5 Posted : 04 January 2022 12:44:32(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post
Thanks for all this, Jenny. I was hoping you might be able to answer.


Whoops! Just noticed I called you Jenny. Apologies. I blame auto-korrektt.
I usually double check things after I post. Must've been tired.


Originally Posted by: Andy Go to Quoted Post


Well, yeah. I tried that.

First two hits show:

1) She's worked for 'Oz PA Hire' 1978-2003.
2) Discogs states 'Freelance audio engineer from Manchester, UK. Has done FOH work for New Order'. I think the 'audio engineer' thing is probably not particular relevant here. 'Front Of House' is relatively informative, but nothing that specific.

Nothing much after that, so it's not like the internet is alive with shed loads of info as to what she did with the band.

I guess I could try and find out exactly what 'OZ PA Hire' did between 1978 and 2003 (as well as hire PAs) and then try to establish exactly what Ms Barton did for the company, day to day, all those years ago. However, this seems like a lot of heavy lifting for potentially little return.

Instead, I thought Johnny James might be able to part with some nuggets of information along the lines of 'yeah, she was a friend of the band, worked a little with Factory between 1983 and 1987, friends with Rob Gretton etc.'. I wondered if there was some connection other than just 'somebody for hire'. A personal friend etc. Why she was, nine times out of ten, lumbered with Steve's bulky camera, rather than some one else? That sort of thing.

If Johnny doesn't know, no problem. I can either research further, or put the matter to bed and call it 'done' (probably the latter).

As much as anything, I'm just trying to keep the conversation alive on this here board (there's, sadly, little movement here at the moment). If I went away and just researched it on my own, only I would benefit.
Just thought others might find the conversation interesting.

Edited by user 04 January 2022 12:51:07(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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tapebias  
#6 Posted : 04 January 2022 14:50:42(UTC)
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Google still has a long way to go!

OZ PA was the main sound hire company in Manchester in the 80s for New Order & The Smiths etc for live concerts. Ozzy McCormick = OZ. Also featured Eddie who was monitor man for New Order during the 80s and partner of Dian although think he passed away recently. If Dian was working for OZ then she would have been at many NO gigs in a sound/tech capacity so would know the band.

Dian did New Order and ACR's sound engineering & live sound in the 00's, maybe she still does although I don't go to see NO these days.
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perspexorange  
#7 Posted : 04 January 2022 15:10:30(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: tapebias Go to Quoted Post


OZ PA was the main sound hire company in Manchester in the 80s for New Order & The Smiths etc for live concerts. Ozzy McCormick = OZ. Also featured Eddie who was monitor man for New Order during the 80s and partner of Dian although think he passed away recently. If Dian was working for OZ then she would have been at many NO gigs in a sound/tech capacity so would know the band.


That’s really helpful and does go some way to explain why she she may have been roped in to camera duties on a regular occasion.

Thanks!

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ROCKET MICK on 05/01/2022(UTC)
tapebias  
#8 Posted : 05 January 2022 10:08:25(UTC)
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You're welcome.

According to Ged Duffy, he filmed Paris '82 in exchange for Steve Morris filming Stockholm Monsters supporting NO. Ged was the bass player.

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ROCKET MICK on 06/01/2022(UTC)
perspexorange  
#9 Posted : 05 January 2022 15:18:00(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: tapebias Go to Quoted Post
You're welcome.

According to Ged Duffy, he filmed Paris '82 in exchange for Steve Morris filming Stockholm Monsters supporting NO. Ged was the bass player.



Ah, cool. Thanks for clearing that up. I’ve actually just ordered a signed copy of Ged’s book. Looking forward to reading it.
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ROCKET MICK on 06/01/2022(UTC)
Jul  
#10 Posted : 08 January 2022 02:53:30(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post
Thanks for all this, Jenny. I was hoping you might be able to answer.

Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post
Dian Barton did quite a few I believe, using Steve's camera.


I noticed that she had done the Kilburn Ballroom footage.
I'm not very familiar with her. Was she a Factory person, or someone freelance? Maybe a friend of Steve's?



Dec's book From Heaven to Heaven mentions Dian quote a few times, I had the impression she was a regular on tours, I had the impression that she was a roadie of some sort. Cannot remember everything precisely, would have to dig through the book again.

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perspexorange  
#11 Posted : 12 January 2022 04:40:02(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Jul Go to Quoted Post

Dec's book From Heaven to Heaven mentions Dian quote a few times, I had the impression she was a regular on tours, I had the impression that she was a roadie of some sort. Cannot remember everything precisely, would have to dig through the book again.



Thanks. I'll dig out my copy of Dec's book (that's always a pleasure; what a magnificent piece of work that book is).

thanks 4 users thanked perspexorange for this useful post.
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