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Like No Other  
#1 Posted : 26 June 2021 14:22:21(UTC)
Like No Other

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Another book to to tell the story.

https://www.palazzoediti...y-division-%2B-new-order
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perspexorange on 27/06/2021(UTC), Rorschach on 27/06/2021(UTC), Mr. Disco on 28/06/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC)
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50poundnote  
#2 Posted : 26 June 2021 21:29:38(UTC)
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“From the ashes of Joy Division” is the laziest, most overused sentence about the band. Instant disqualification.

(Not to mention Ian was cremated.)
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ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC)
Fotz  
#3 Posted : 26 June 2021 23:57:21(UTC)
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Jeez, nothing like reading the same old story over and over again. And that pixelated image on the cover is crap, unoriginal and half arsed lazy.
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ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC)
perspexorange  
#4 Posted : 27 June 2021 05:26:58(UTC)
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Ah, I'll give it a go!

The photo choices look interesting, for one thing. Much as I love the usual Cummins/Corbijn shots, it's nice to see something different.
200+ photos sounds pretty good (and in full colour, no less).

I know the whole 'from the ashes' thing is a bit overused (although I hear Mr Monkhouse is very partial to the term), maybe the book is more geared to new fans (rather than us jaded old ones that have read multiple biographies).

It's up on Amazon.co.uk, if anyone would rather not use an 'unknown' supplier and doesn't mind feeding the fat cats at Amazon:

https://www.amazon.co.uk...id=1624800422&sr=8-1

Looks like it'll be a hardcover too, which is quite nice.

I've preordered (07/10/21 release day, according to Amazon).
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Like No Other on 27/06/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC)
Like No Other  
#5 Posted : 27 June 2021 11:49:19(UTC)
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Can preorder for £20 on WHSmith website. Might go for it and combine with the Rebel Remix Vinyl + CD - £40 in total as £12 off £50 spend at moment.
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ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#6 Posted : 27 June 2021 12:30:28(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: 50poundnote Go to Quoted Post
“From the ashes of Joy Division” is the laziest, most overused sentence about the band. Instant disqualification.

(Not to mention Ian was cremated.)


Let's not forget describing 'The Other Two' moniker as 'self-effacing' and describing what it means. There's no way we'd've worked it out after 30 years.
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ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC)
Coops  
#7 Posted : 27 June 2021 23:03:55(UTC)
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"He has interviewed almost every major pop star of the past three decades, including Kurt Cobain, Fugees, Ed Sheeran, Elton John, Enya, Kate Bush, Beyonce, Britney Spears, Bon Jovi, Pet Shop Boys, Simply Red, Mark E. Smith, Frankie Valli, Iron Maiden, Kylie Minogue, Depeche Mode, Celine Dion, Chris Cornell, Joe Strummer, Take That, George Michael, Mariah Carey, Cranberries, Blur, Iron Maiden, Public Enemy, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Amy Winehouse, Pink Floyd, Fleetwood Mac, Shania Twain, The Cure, Sting and a host of others"


But not New Order by the looks of itLaugh Laugh
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Like No Other on 28/06/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC), Michael Monkhouse on 26/09/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#8 Posted : 28 June 2021 04:10:14(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post
maybe the book is more geared to new fans (rather than us jaded old ones that have read multiple biographies).
.

I'm not convinced there's any such thing as a new fan. One new single in 6 years, by today's media-heavy standards, is hardly gonna pull the crowds.
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ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC)
perspexorange  
#9 Posted : 28 June 2021 06:22:30(UTC)
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Well, yeah, you're probably mostly right.

I do think, though, that use of songs on films/TV programmes regularly generate enough interest in the band to convert a few people.

A good example was the use of 'Blue Monday' in that Wonder Woman trailer and in Ready Player One. I would guess that that did get a few inquisitive people to check out some other tunes.

Similarly, use of the much less known 'Elegia' in signifiant media such as Metal Gear Solid trailer and Stranger Things led to some interest.
I remember watching the clip from Stranger Things on YouTube and, reading the comments, there were people who were mentioning both New Order and Metal Gear Solid.
Considering Kojima's love of the band, and the fan devotion there is to his work, I'd be very surprised if there weren't a tonne of newer fans who came to the band directly from MGS.

Also, the various Facebook groups seem to be full of younger fans (especially from mainland Europe and South America).




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negative1 on 29/06/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#10 Posted : 28 June 2021 06:47:41(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post

I do think, though, that use of songs on films/TV programmes regularly generate enough interest in the band to convert a few people.




0.19 - 0.23 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiTPWJTi3Zw
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ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC)
Debaser  
#11 Posted : 28 June 2021 07:18:51(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Coops Go to Quoted Post
"He has interviewed almost every major pop star of the past three decades, including Kurt Cobain, Fugees, Ed Sheeran, Elton John, Enya, Kate Bush, Beyonce, Britney Spears, Bon Jovi, Pet Shop Boys, Simply Red, Mark E. Smith, Frankie Valli, Iron Maiden, Kylie Minogue, Depeche Mode, Celine Dion, Chris Cornell, Joe Strummer, Take That, George Michael, Mariah Carey, Cranberries, Blur, Iron Maiden, Public Enemy, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Amy Winehouse, Pink Floyd, Fleetwood Mac, Shania Twain, The Cure, Sting and a host of others"


Iron Maiden mentioned twice there. Barely worth mentioning once.

Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post
Well, yeah, you're probably mostly right.
....Also, the various Facebook groups seem to be full of younger fans .


Yeah that's kinda true. You often see comments like "Hey I've only just discovered TBTHOG because it wasn't on Substance." Or "Did anyone know there was a film called Married To The Mob which had a different version of BLT?"

Originally Posted by: Michael Monkhouse Go to Quoted Post


"Video unavailable.
This video contains content from Channel 4, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds."
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ROCKET MICK on 11/07/2021(UTC)
perspexorange  
#12 Posted : 26 September 2021 02:01:09(UTC)
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There's a pretty decent interview with the author in this podcast:

https://thehustle.podbea...ision-new-order-decades/

Thanks to SB on JDC for pointing this out, as I'd have missed it.


From the interview, it does appear that a lot of the research may well have been done from the individual autobiographies, so it probably won't contain anything we don't already know.
Not much of a surprise that, really.
However, to be fair, us long-term fans are probably never going to find any new information in a book written by someone not connected to the band.

By the sounds of things, though, the book will (hopefully) be a decent account of the band's history. Nicely presented too, by the sounds of things.

I know there's a bit of negativity further up this thread, but I'm personally really looking forward to this. Even if it's just for the photos.
I'll post back here when I get my copy.
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negative1 on 26/09/2021(UTC), Like No Other on 27/09/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
perspexorange  
#13 Posted : 26 September 2021 03:25:53(UTC)
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I should point out that Aizlewood is very passionate in his interview and, fair play to him, he actually saw JD live (I'm more than slightly jealous!).

So although, as pointed out above, it doesn't look like he interviewed the band (*), he sounds like someone that knows his stuff and, presumably, hasn't gone into the project half-arsed.


(*) I haven't heard the whole podcast yet, so maybe he did interview the band and will mention this later on.

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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#14 Posted : 26 September 2021 08:26:18(UTC)
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So what? I'm passionare about the Spice Girls and have downloaded all the vids with my free hand, no one's gonna wanna read about it.
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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
Debaser  
#15 Posted : 26 September 2021 13:47:38(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Michael Monkhouse Go to Quoted Post
So what? I'm passionare about the Spice Girls and have downloaded all the vids with my free hand, no one's gonna wanna read about it.


Difference is: the Spice Girls were musically sh*t, and mostly appealed to (1) girls aged 6 to 14, (2) marketing men and showbiz reporters and (3) blokes who were too ashamed to buy porn. I agreed with Eminem when he said he "can't figure out which Spice Girl I want to impregnate". The more you scrutinized them, the less attractive any one of them actually was.

I never thought JD looked too atractive either, but their impact on music was a little bit more important. At least it was/is for those who are interested.
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perspexorange on 26/09/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#16 Posted : 26 September 2021 14:24:15(UTC)
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The point I was making is that his credentials are hardly stunning, apart from having seen them live a grand total of two times and interviewed a bunch of acts who have sweet Fanny Adams to do with anything.
I think you (and by extension Perspex) have misunderstood my post. I wasn't saying there's no point reading about one of the most important bands in the post punk world, or comparing them to a pile of shit like Joy division, just that he's not much more entitled to research and write about the subject than any other fan is about their favourite band. And yeah, given that there are approximately 765437 bukes already, and this fab new database called the interweb, you have to add more to the mix than I saw em a coupla times forty years ago, honest guv.
I'm glad you do not find Melanie C attractive. Less competition for me.
Actually, I never thought any of the Spice Girls was particularly hot. That was part of the appeal. Read about this in my forthcoming book, 'Actually I never thought any of the Spice Girls was particularly hot. That was part of the appeal'.

Edited by user 26 September 2021 21:56:50(UTC)  | Reason: Spice up your life

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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
Debaser  
#17 Posted : 27 September 2021 03:05:30(UTC)
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Well it seems that there are certain subjects which are almost guaranteed to get you some sales if you approach them with a bit of effort.
Factory/JD/NO seems to be one of those subjects. Which is probably why Paul Borely has done another Factory/Wilson related book (which someone on twitter announced they had already received in the post, although it's not out til 21st October). Here's a guy at Faber & Faber trying to hustle an advance copy into Terry Christian's hands:


Should such works be limited strictly to "the professional"? Well there's an argument that fan experiences are also worth documenting. The Beasties Boys once handed out a bunch of video cameras to their fans in order to film a gig from the audience persective. A film called Blinded By The Light came out in 2019 - a semi-autobiographical drama about a British-Asian guy growing up in Luton and finding inspiration in....Bruce Springsteen. And of course our own Dennis here on the forum tells us he has a publication deal for his Ceremony to Superheated blog.

I guess sometimes it just depends on how well you do things.

Having said that, the chances of me buying this latest JD effort are virtually nil. But if someone else wants to read it and report back on any interesting bits here on the forum, then I'll happily pay attention for a minute or two!

My previous post was really my way of having a pop at a girl band I care little for. Other than Carl Urban/Billy Bucther's Spice Girls releated speech in series 2 of The Boys, my interest in "the girls" has been virtually zero since about 1997. But now alas, they're starting to pop up again in retrospectives about the 90's Dead . I live in hope that one day I may never have to hear them mentioned again...


EDIT: Ok this guy actually is a "professional". So it may well be just another cash-in. We'll see, next month.

Edited by user 27 September 2021 03:21:27(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
GotBlueEyes  
#18 Posted : 27 September 2021 03:24:41(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post

From the interview, it does appear that a lot of the research may well have been done from the individual autobiographies, so it probably won't contain anything we don't already know.


Funny - I was talking to a friend the other day about all the NO/JD (auto)biographies and how the same stories have been told from almost every angle now and that it would be interesting to somehow read them all simultaneously

Therefore, the one book I'd like to read, is one that does some proper analysis of the differences from each viewpoint and lays it all out in sequence

Maybe that's what this guy has done. We shall see


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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#19 Posted : 27 September 2021 03:45:32(UTC)
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I doubt it.
Tbh I'd prefer the opposite approach: hard FACts (see what I etc) instead of yet more Borely bolox, Savage shite and Wilson wank. The best Beatle writer for me is Mark Lewishon and I'd love to see something similar here:
1. A day by day history
2. A day by day recording history
3. A kinda Lett's Study Aids summary, cramming the salient facts into 80 Pages. Yummy.
What's the difference between covid and the Spice Girls? Covid might go away
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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
perspexorange  
#20 Posted : 27 September 2021 05:56:19(UTC)
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I think that Aizlewood is both a fan and a professional.

As regards being a fan, he apparently saw JD at the Apollo gigs, supporting Buzzcocks. He also mentioned that he had seen New Order several times, including in the early years.
He hasn't seen them since Hook left (or the band spilt, depending on your perspective ;-) ), but that is apparently due to logistics, rather than any sort of statement by him on the ongoing 'band politics'.
In the interview, he gushed about the band. Mainly JD, but he still obviously loves NO).

As regards being a pro, his website blurb seems to carry decent credentials and it looks like he's written for a lot of highly-regarded publications.

So, I think it's fair to say that we may get a relatively decent book.

It also sounds like he doesn't have a particular axe to grind. He appears to have culled information from the band members' autobiographies, so it may cover a fair number of subjects and may contain reference to their differing perspectives.

At the very least, I think we'll get a book that will look nice (based on the sample of photos shown) and will be written by someone who both likes the band and is an experienced writer.

Possibly most important, it will cover a period in the band previously largely ignored (i.e. the Cunnigham/Chapman era). It'll be nice to have (within reason) a complete history of the band.

But, who knows, eh?
We shall see.






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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#21 Posted : 27 September 2021 06:19:14(UTC)
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It'd be grate to have a complete documentary, like 'Joy Division', The Pistols' 'Filth and Fury' or the Beatles' 'Anthology', but it's probably too sprawling. 'New Order Story' was so awful people later tried to pass it off as tongue-in-cheek, but it wasn't. NME praised it for being one of the few docs that summed up the character of the subject and Claud Flowers called that beyond cringeworthy narration 'rapturous'.

Edited by user 27 September 2021 06:22:03(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
perspexorange  
#22 Posted : 27 September 2021 07:11:14(UTC)
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I agree. A decent documentary would be very much welcomed.

I will say though, although not visual, that 'Transmissions' podcast from late last year was wonderful.
Hopefully they're making more of these, as that only went up to the release of 'Blue Monday'.
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Like No Other on 27/09/2021(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#23 Posted : 27 September 2021 07:27:23(UTC)
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... And I know Wings aren't to everyone's taste, but Wingspan was the perfect format: No bullshit, no done-to-death pomos, no journo wankuz, no 'Yeah I used to live in the same hemisphere as Linda's cat once', just an exclusive Paul interview-cum-footage on every year from the inauspicious start to the megatour to falling apart again. That's how like my docs.
Today's Interesting Fact About Wings: On 6 February 2004, the subject of Wings came up and someone didn't quote Alan Partridge. Respect!
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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
50poundnote  
#24 Posted : 27 September 2021 07:30:25(UTC)
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For a band with 2 studio albums and a handful of singles, more books have been written about them than they have compilations, which is saying something.

Really, really bored with Joy Division.

I want a proper documentary that covers the band from 1981 to 1993 and DOESN'T talk about Ian.
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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#25 Posted : 27 September 2021 07:55:44(UTC)
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Joy Division are shit.
They could do a New Order Story 2 - not something as beyond unwatchable as that crap, but the post-Repubelic story, cos that period's been one more often than my mother.
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ROCKET MICK on 07/11/2021(UTC)
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