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perspexorange  
#1 Posted : 04 February 2023 02:50:25(UTC)
perspexorange

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Not sure if I've mentioned some of these before.

Whilst looking through a few old trade lists from people who used to trade New Order stuff back in the 80s/90s, I noticed the following listed and just wondered if anyone had more info (or, better still, copies):

1) 'Confusion - US Mono Mix' (5 minutes) (08/1983)

This rings a bell with me.
I'm sure I've read somewhere that there was a mono version on one of the US releases. I thought it might've been the 'Streetwise' release, but Discogs says otherwise.
Anyone know what this is? Mr Discography etc?

2) 'Blue Monday (Australian Remixes) (1983)

There appears to be three separate remixes listed for these.
I'm guessing that these are either a) fan made or b) made by specific radio stations (possibly edits to reduce the song down to a more 'radio friendly' format).
Anyone know?

3) 'Rough Mixes' (15 minutes) (12/1983)

I have absolutely no idea what these are. The only thing I can think they may be are the 'rough mixes' for 'Thieves Like Us' and 'Lonesome Tonight' that were being traded back in the 80s. But the time period looks to be a bit early.

4) 'The Definitive Joy Division Remix' (90 minutes) (1978-1980)

I'm really not sure about this. I'm guessing it's a fan made remix. But at 90mins, they must've slung pretty much every JD track into it. Crikey. It's probably dreadful.

5) 'Re-Order Blue Monday Nightclub Mix' (15 minutes) (1987)

No idea what this is. My first thought was that 'Dakeyne of DMC 'Re-Ordered Megamix', but the timing is quite a bit off (9:49 compared with 15:00).
Probably a fan-made thing. Anyone heard of it?

6) 'Confusion - first Dave Jensen play, Radio 1' (5 minutes)

Self explanatory. Would be interested to hear this. As it's been traded, someone on here might have a copy.

7) 'Thieves Like Us - Radio 1 "Round Table"' (04/1984) (6 minutes)

I'm guessing this is a discussion by various musicians about that week's singles. I have one of these for 'Low Life' and I think there might be one for 'The Perfect Kiss' too (although I've never seen this being traded).

8) 'Warner Records Promo Cassette' (2 minutes) (01/1989)

No idea what this. At 2 minutes, I'm guessing it's some sort of extract of an in-house tape advertising 'Technique'.

9) 'She's Lost Control (Dodgy Remix)' (6 minutes) (1993)

Judging by the name, I'm guessing this is fan-made.

10) 'BBC TV Whistle Test - Perfect Kiss promo clip' (5 minutes)

This is self explanatory and probably not of much interest, considering it probably doesn't contain anything new.
Still, I'd be interested to see what was said about the video, the presentation etc.

11) T In The Park, Festival, Balado, Kinross, UK, 12/07/97 (Monaco) (12/07/97)

Looks like someone might've had a copy of this gig. INot sure if it's come off the radio or is an unofficial recording. If the latter, I wasn't aware anyone had taped it.




I know it's highly unlikely that anybody knows what these things are (and even more unlikely that someone will have these), but I thought 'nothing ventured, nothing gained'.
If you do know what any of these are or want to put forward a suggestion, I'd be very interested.

Time to dig out those old TDK SA90s (ahhh - those were the days, eh?).

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ROCKET MICK on 04/02/2023(UTC), negative1 on 17/02/2023(UTC)
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Fotz  
#2 Posted : 04 February 2023 03:42:54(UTC)
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Well i know a couple of them but no, i don't have them.

The TPK video on Whistle Test i definitely remember seeing.They showed about 5 minutes of it or maybe even less.It was around April or May 85 and when the programme was on a Tuesday early evening 7pm.Think it was David Hepworth or Mark Ellen that introduced the clip as i recall.


I'm sure i heard that TPK review on Roundtable, May 85.Memory very foggy on that though.Don't think i heard that Thieves Like Us on Roundtable review in 84 though but i think i may have heard its first ever play on Radio 1 on Annie Nightingale's Sunday night show.Well i definitely heard her play it but not 100% sure it was the first play.Felt like it though! Annie didn't actually introduce the song, only at the end did she reveal it was TLU.But when that drumbeat intro came out of the radio, then the synths i thought hmm this sounds like New Order.This was confirmed when Hooky's bass came in.Annie did the same thing with Lonesome Tonight the following week, she only said what the song and artist was after the end.This would have been late March/early April 1984.

Oh and i recall hearing BLT reviewed on Roundtable in November 86.Think Alexei Sayle was a guest and he wouldn't be drawn either way on if he liked it or not, he just opined that New Order seemed like they were very loved by the music press.


Also, i remember seeing the video for Blue Monday on Whistle Test in early 1984, would have been Jan or Feb.This was when the programme was still in its late night Friday slot.


But no, sadly i don't have any of the things you've listed, p.Only the ones i've mentioned i have as a, sometimes very vague, memory.
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ROCKET MICK on 04/02/2023(UTC), negative1 on 17/02/2023(UTC)
perspexorange  
#3 Posted : 04 February 2023 04:04:23(UTC)
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Thanks for the info, F! At least there's some memories of these.

I'm guessing that some fans must have these lurking on tapes somewhere, due to the fact that they were on trade lists.

It's funny that Alexei Sayle was featured on a 'Round Table'. I guess comedians might've been in the same sphere as musicians and it's not unheard of for them to feature on music programmes. Sayle also had a brief pop career a few years before this, if I remember correctly ('Ullo John! Gotta New Motor?').

I've probably asked you this before, but was the video for 'Blue Monday' on 'Whistle Test' the computer-generated Stephen Morris thing?
I wonder how many times that video was ever seen by the public. I know it was featured on the 'Rock Of Europe' S&G interview on Music Box in January '88, but can't think of any other showings off hand.

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ROCKET MICK on 04/02/2023(UTC), negative1 on 17/02/2023(UTC)
Fotz  
#4 Posted : 04 February 2023 04:15:09(UTC)
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^ Oh the BM video on Whistle Test was most definitely Steve's computer generated thing, yup.I was glued to the screen watching. All that imagery and Trident missiles (or similar) being fired felt very, very of the time, what with the Cold War seemingly at its height around that 80s era.
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ROCKET MICK on 04/02/2023(UTC)
perspexorange  
#5 Posted : 04 February 2023 04:37:38(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
^ Oh the BM video on Whistle Test was most definitely Steve's computer generated thing, yup.I was glued to the screen watching. All that imagery and Trident missiles (or similar) being fired felt very, very of the time, what with the Cold War seemingly at its height around that 80s era.


Thanks. Thought that seemed likely.

I know that OGWT used to get (independent film makers) 'Filmfinders' to make videos for songs that didn't have them. They did that with 'Isolation' when they played that track on 22/11/80.
Just wondered in case it was something unique that OGWT had crafted on this occasion.
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ROCKET MICK on 04/02/2023(UTC)
perspexorange  
#6 Posted : 04 February 2023 04:49:03(UTC)
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Just in case anyone is interested in what that 'Filmfinders' clip of 'Isolation' looked like, a friend of mine managed to acquire it about a year or so ago.

Check out a very rarely seen early 'national TV' play of a JD song from 22/11/80 (along with an intro that states the band had 'decided to carry on, using the name New Order') here:

https://drive.google.com...UzQTCKw0_3CnnnSjB8U/view

From 19:35 onwards.
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ROCKET MICK on 04/02/2023(UTC), Fotz on 04/02/2023(UTC)
Fotz  
#7 Posted : 04 February 2023 06:29:11(UTC)
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Thanks for that Filmfinders thing.Yes i'd read about it before, probably you've mentioned it, perspex but first time i've seen it.Yes, i see what you mean that if you'd not seen the Whistle Test where Steve's BM vid was shown you might wonder if it'd been another Filmfinders video but no it was definitely Steve's one.

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perspexorange on 04/02/2023(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 04/02/2023(UTC)
perspexorange  
#8 Posted : 04 February 2023 07:55:24(UTC)
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Cool. Thanks Fotz. Makes sense. There was a video already available and Steve may have been keen to show it off (although, as I mentioned before, showings seem few and far between, unless MTV/Music Box etc. showed it until the '88 video came out).


Anybody else have any recollections / comments about the items listed above?
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ROCKET MICK on 04/02/2023(UTC)
Fotz  
#9 Posted : 17 February 2023 15:10:45(UTC)
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I wonder from time to time, what does it involve or indeed is it even possible to make a request to BBC for a copy of an old tv programne. And what kind of cost would we be talking? Probably too much faff and financial outlay to make it worthwhile? And that's without taking into consideration that there even is a master in the BBC archives of the edition in question that you're after? The one i'm interested in is World Cup Football Focus 31.05.86 to settle this old puzzle for me about a work colleague telling me he'd seen a different version of LV ( what turned out apparently to be the TV Pitch version on the Low Life box , 36 odd years later) soundtrack a pre World Cup 86 montage. Of course, any sane person would say crikey is it worth the bother?
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ROCKET MICK on 18/02/2023(UTC), Jul on 19/02/2023(UTC)
Debaser  
#10 Posted : 17 February 2023 16:47:00(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
I wonder from time to time, what does it involve or indeed is it even possible to make a request to BBC for a copy of an old tv programne. And what kind of cost would we be talking? Probably too much faff and financial outlay to make it worthwhile? And that's without taking into consideration that there even is a master in the BBC archives of the edition in question that you're after? The one i'm interested in is World Cup Football Focus 31.05.86 to settle this old puzzle for me about a work colleague telling me he'd seen a different version of LV ( what turned out apparently to be the TV Pitch version on the Low Life box , 36 odd years later) soundtrack a pre World Cup 86 montage. Of course, any sane person would say crikey is it worth the bother?


Crikey is it worth the bother?

Take up Wordle; it's fun, innit!


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ROCKET MICK on 18/02/2023(UTC), Fotz on 18/02/2023(UTC)
perspexorange  
#11 Posted : 18 February 2023 01:57:22(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
I wonder from time to time, what does it involve or indeed is it even possible to make a request to BBC for a copy of an old tv programne. And what kind of cost would we be talking? Probably too much faff and financial outlay to make it worthwhile? And that's without taking into consideration that there even is a master in the BBC archives of the edition in question that you're after? The one i'm interested in is World Cup Football Focus 31.05.86 to settle this old puzzle for me about a work colleague telling me he'd seen a different version of LV ( what turned out apparently to be the TV Pitch version on the Low Life box , 36 odd years later) soundtrack a pre World Cup 86 montage. Of course, any sane person would say crikey is it worth the bother?


I did put out some 'feelers' regarding this programme for you, Fotz. Just to see if it is in the BBC archives.
No response as yet.



As to whether it's worth the bother. I would think the price would be high. Plus there's the issue of them selling programmes to individuals rather than TV stations. They'd probably want to know what our intentions were and would make us sign legal documents that we couldn't trade copies etc. They could also be reluctant as it might set a precedent, opening the floodgates to a lot of other requests.

But I admit I don't know the inner workings the BBC, ITV etc., so this is all speculation on my part. Who knows? They might be receptive.


PS Thanks to some kind soul on here, I've managed to snag a copy of number 11, Monaco at T In The Park. Yay!
See - it was worth me asking here! :-)
Anybody else able to help with items 1-10? Pretty please!
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Fotz on 18/02/2023(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 19/02/2023(UTC)
Fotz  
#12 Posted : 18 February 2023 02:44:26(UTC)
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Thanks, perspex.But yeah, maybe i'll try Debaser's suggestion and try this Wordle thingy instead Smile
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Debaser on 18/02/2023(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 19/02/2023(UTC)
Debaser  
#13 Posted : 18 February 2023 07:44:22(UTC)
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As a counterpoint to my last comment, I would still love the full unedited version(s) of A Midsummer Night's Tube (83 or 84? I forget now) to be unearthed so that I could hopefully prove that a Bernard+Hooky live performance did take place on a Dutch TV show - possibly playing an incomplete BM. But I'm not holding my breath, since the custodians of those archives went bust several years ago...
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Fotz on 18/02/2023(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 19/02/2023(UTC)
EmileStrunz  
#14 Posted : 18 February 2023 12:10:03(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
I wonder from time to time, what does it involve or indeed is it even possible to make a request to BBC for a copy of an old tv programne. And what kind of cost would we be talking? Probably too much faff and financial outlay to make it worthwhile? And that's without taking into consideration that there even is a master in the BBC archives of the edition in question that you're after? The one i'm interested in is World Cup Football Focus 31.05.86 to settle this old puzzle for me about a work colleague telling me he'd seen a different version of LV ( what turned out apparently to be the TV Pitch version on the Low Life box , 36 odd years later) soundtrack a pre World Cup 86 montage. Of course, any sane person would say crikey is it worth the bother?


First time I ever heard ‘Your Silent Face’ it was used on a football montage of amazing football skills at half time on the 1987 FA Cup final
It had the Cruyff turn etc
Would love to see that again

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ROCKET MICK on 19/02/2023(UTC), Jul on 19/02/2023(UTC)
Fotz  
#15 Posted : 18 February 2023 13:00:04(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: EmileStrunz Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
I wonder from time to time, what does it involve or indeed is it even possible to make a request to BBC for a copy of an old tv programne. And what kind of cost would we be talking? Probably too much faff and financial outlay to make it worthwhile? And that's without taking into consideration that there even is a master in the BBC archives of the edition in question that you're after? The one i'm interested in is World Cup Football Focus 31.05.86 to settle this old puzzle for me about a work colleague telling me he'd seen a different version of LV ( what turned out apparently to be the TV Pitch version on the Low Life box , 36 odd years later) soundtrack a pre World Cup 86 montage. Of course, any sane person would say crikey is it worth the bother?


First time I ever heard ‘Your Silent Face’ it was used on a football montage of amazing football skills at half time on the 1987 FA Cup final
It had the Cruyff turn etc
Would love to see that again



Yes i remember that. First time i think i'd seen & heard a NO song used in such a way on tv.

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ROCKET MICK on 19/02/2023(UTC)
perspexorange  
#16 Posted : 28 February 2023 02:26:51(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post


10) 'BBC TV Whistle Test - Perfect Kiss promo clip' (5 minutes)

This is self explanatory and probably not of much interest, considering it probably doesn't contain anything new.
Still, I'd be interested to see what was said about the video, the presentation etc.



Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
Yes, i see what you mean that if you'd not seen the Whistle Test where Steve's BM vid was shown you might wonder if it'd been another Filmfinders video but no it was definitely Steve's one.



Managed to snag both of these Whistle Test appearances thanks to a guy on another forum.
The Blue Monday clip is very short. Only about 1 minute and is shown as part of an 'indie chart' countdown. It is, indeed, Steve's homemade video and is partially obscured by on-screen text showing the indie charts.

The Perfect Kiss is also similarly located within the 'chart segment' of the show. Thankfully they had the good sense to not obscure this masterpiece with text, although they did cut the length down to 4 minutes. They do mention that the full video is 10 minutes in length and that it is directed by Demme.
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ROCKET MICK on 28/02/2023(UTC)
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