logo
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
perspexorange  
#1 Posted : 23 January 2020 10:21:18(UTC)
perspexorange

Rank: Member with Technique

Groups: Registered
Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC)
Posts: 944
Location: Shropshire, UK

Thanks: 206 times
Was thanked: 1218 time(s) in 941 post(s)
Just bought a copy of the new issue of Mojo (or, at least my wife did).

Amongst the various pages is a half-page article on the Whitehead ‘Joy Division’ film.
It talks a little about the film, but also gives a fairly detailed description of it.

One thing of particular note in the article is the following:

“Though Whitehead stated that he had sold the film to the Cherry Red label, Hooky argues the ownership is disputed (the label told Mojo, “Cherry Red acquired the rights to the footage but need an agreement from the band for a commercial release”). He hopes, though, that fans won’t have to wait much longer to see it.”

So, although, there does appear to be a complication with ownership, there are possible moves afoot to try and get a release, both by Hooky and Cherry Red (possibly coming at it from opposing sides).

Also, it’s a good sign that at least one member of the band would like to see it released (Hooky goes on to say “I’d love it to come out”).
There have always been rumours that the band weren’t keen due to the use of Nuremberg rally footage in the film. I guess that was mainly back in the day though, when people were accusing them of Nazi sympathising (apparently it was going to be on the HATYM tape but that was nixed because of that reason).
I’m sure nobody now thinks that they’re Nazis, so I’m sure it could be released without those sort of concerns.

Good news, anyway. I would absolutely love a copy of the whole film, i.e. in the context in which it was meant to be shown rather than just the Bowden Vale footage on its own.
thanks 2 users thanked perspexorange for this useful post.
Fotz on 25/01/2020(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 28/01/2020(UTC)
Sponsor
50poundnote  
#2 Posted : 23 January 2020 12:23:19(UTC)
50poundnote

Rank: Member of the Republic

Groups: Registered
Joined: 29/04/2012(UTC)
Posts: 182

Was thanked: 275 time(s) in 178 post(s)
Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post
I’m sure nobody now thinks that they’re Nazis


Are you sure?
thanks 1 user thanked 50poundnote for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 24/01/2020(UTC)
Mr Discography  
#3 Posted : 24 January 2020 14:34:55(UTC)
Mr Discography

Rank: Member of the Republic

Groups: Registered
Joined: 20/05/2012(UTC)
Posts: 113
Man

Was thanked: 164 time(s) in 114 post(s)
What exactly is the "Whitehead" film?
thanks 1 user thanked Mr Discography for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 28/01/2020(UTC)
perspexorange  
#4 Posted : 24 January 2020 16:17:15(UTC)
perspexorange

Rank: Member with Technique

Groups: Registered
Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC)
Posts: 944
Location: Shropshire, UK

Thanks: 206 times
Was thanked: 1218 time(s) in 941 post(s)
From joydiv.org:

“Joy Division - A Film By Malcolm Whitehead

This 17 minute film was included in The Factory Flick - see above listing.

Features footage of the band in rehearsal at TJ Davidson March or April 79 with various soundtracks dubbed over the top including speeches by Anderton (the Manchester Police chief at the time) and the SS oath of allegiance. There's an interview with Joy Division's manager Rob Gretton recorded March 23rd 1979 and 3 songs fom Bowden Vale 14 March 79. We guess these are probably the same ones that are on the Substance video ie She's Lost Control, Shadowplay, Leaders of Men.

Apparently this was considered for inclusion on the Here Are The Young Men video but the band didn't like the idea. “

It’s basically the Bowden Vale footage, brief rehearsal footage (presumably the same as was shown on the Grant Gee documentary) and a Rob Gretton interview. This is all ‘framed’ within a short film that juxtaposes James Anderson with the Nazis and tries to illustrate urban decay within cities etc. Or so it seems.
Apparently Whitehead wanted to interview the band too, but they were in a ‘playful’ mood and weren’t really co-operating. Malcolm didn’t want to waste the expensive film, so only interviewed Rob.
thanks 1 user thanked perspexorange for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 28/01/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#5 Posted : 25 January 2020 14:02:40(UTC)
Fotz

Rank: Guilty Partner

Groups: Registered
Joined: 02/08/2014(UTC)
Posts: 1,535
Location: Down on the farm

Thanks: 342 times
Was thanked: 1983 time(s) in 1532 post(s)
Spotted the Mojo edition in WH Smith today with JD on the cover.What, yet another JD Mojo/Uncut/A.N Other mag cover feature i thought.What possible new angle can they find for another multi page spread that they haven't done before? I was just starting to have a glance through and found the bit about the Whitehead film but then some bloke near me perusing some magazine started coughing and shit and i put Mojo back on the shelf and ran off, not wanting to catch the flu or something.I'll look again sometime and see if it's worth buying.

Are those brief and silent clips in Grant Gee's 'Joy Division' documentary from the Whitehead film? Can't recall now.Those short clips of Bernard ,Steve and Hooky smiling to camera, Steve in a light coloured 70s blazer.

Oh and i did see some latest edition of Classic Pop magazine has a spread reviewing all NO's albums.
thanks 1 user thanked Fotz for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 28/01/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#6 Posted : 25 January 2020 14:06:29(UTC)
Fotz

Rank: Guilty Partner

Groups: Registered
Joined: 02/08/2014(UTC)
Posts: 1,535
Location: Down on the farm

Thanks: 342 times
Was thanked: 1983 time(s) in 1532 post(s)
Originally Posted by: 50poundnote Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post
I’m sure nobody now thinks that they’re Nazis


Are you sure?



haha, yes.I took it as perspexorange's mischievous little joke/dig.
thanks 1 user thanked Fotz for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 28/01/2020(UTC)
perspexorange  
#7 Posted : 25 January 2020 15:13:50(UTC)
perspexorange

Rank: Member with Technique

Groups: Registered
Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC)
Posts: 944
Location: Shropshire, UK

Thanks: 206 times
Was thanked: 1218 time(s) in 941 post(s)
Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post

Are those brief and silent clips in Grant Gee's 'Joy Division' documentary from the Whitehead film? Can't recall now.Those short clips of Bernard ,Steve and Hooky smiling to camera, Steve in a light coloured 70s blazer



I’ve always assumed that those clips are part of the rehearsal footage included in the film, but maybe they are outtakes, i.e. the bits that they were messing about with, that was deemed to not be included in the film.

I think those bits are magnificent. To see Joy Division, relaxing, having fun is just a wonderful sight. I admit that, when I first saw that footage (and Gee’s superb documentary in general) I think I did get a bit misty-eyed.
JD are always considered this doom-laden band and, although us fans know better, it was still a joyous thing to watch them smiling and having fun.
Just thinking about it makes me want this film released even more. There’s so little JD material out there, we need to see more.
thanks 1 user thanked perspexorange for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 28/01/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#8 Posted : 25 January 2020 17:48:10(UTC)
Fotz

Rank: Guilty Partner

Groups: Registered
Joined: 02/08/2014(UTC)
Posts: 1,535
Location: Down on the farm

Thanks: 342 times
Was thanked: 1983 time(s) in 1532 post(s)
Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post

Are those brief and silent clips in Grant Gee's 'Joy Division' documentary from the Whitehead film? Can't recall now.Those short clips of Bernard ,Steve and Hooky smiling to camera, Steve in a light coloured 70s blazer



I
I think those bits are magnificent. To see Joy Division, relaxing, having fun is just a wonderful sight. I admit that, when I first saw that footage (and Gee’s superb documentary in general) I think I did get a bit misty-eyed.
JD are always considered this doom-laden band and, although us fans know better, it was still a joyous thing to watch them smiling and having fun.
Just thinking about it makes me want this film released even more. There’s so little JD material out there, we need to see more.


Yep my heart and gut tells me that's the real Joy Division right there in that grainy late 70s footage.A whole universe away from the JD that was portrayed in the 80s music papers and in that Control film.Sometimes wish that film had never been made.
thanks 1 user thanked Fotz for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 28/01/2020(UTC)
perspexorange  
#9 Posted : 25 January 2020 18:47:25(UTC)
perspexorange

Rank: Member with Technique

Groups: Registered
Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC)
Posts: 944
Location: Shropshire, UK

Thanks: 206 times
Was thanked: 1218 time(s) in 941 post(s)
I still like ‘Control’ but, yeah, it very probably wasn’t representative of the band we know and love.
I think the Grant Gee documentary captured the personalities of the three very well. A wonderful piece and probably the best documentary of any band I’ve seen.
I do tend to watch a fair few music documentaries. Even with bands I don’t like. I always think that most bands have lived really interesting lives and am always kind of fascinated by them.
But the JD documentary takes the biscuit. It does, of course, help with the fact that the JD/NO/Factory story is certainly one of the most interesting in music history.

PS glad to see you’re back as ‘Fotz’. 😊😊😊
thanks 1 user thanked perspexorange for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 28/01/2020(UTC)
Fotz  
#10 Posted : 26 January 2020 01:41:59(UTC)
Fotz

Rank: Guilty Partner

Groups: Registered
Joined: 02/08/2014(UTC)
Posts: 1,535
Location: Down on the farm

Thanks: 342 times
Was thanked: 1983 time(s) in 1532 post(s)
Well maybe i was a little harsh last night on Control.Was a bit drunk.I liked the film but not completely, there was some things not right about it i could never quite put my finger on but of course it's impossible for any film maker to completely get a film about a band or singer 100% accurately portrayed and hats off to Anton Corbijn for what he did with the JD story.Maybe it was some of the casting i didn't agree with, i mean i never felt Craig Parkinson was a great choice to play Tony Wilson.Always thought that was an odd choice but then who else could have done it.Sam Riley was a little too handsome and poster boy ish as Ian Curtis.The best bit of casting in any of the JD or Factory films is Paddy Considine as Rob Gretton in 24HPP.Brilliantly played by Paddy, spot on.


I think Grant Gee's doc captures Joy Division way better than Control in the same way Play At Home captures Factory way better than 24 Hour Party People. 'Joy Division' and Play At Home are both documentaries of course but if anyone asked me what would be a good watch to get the story of Joy Division and Factory i'd direct them to those 2 docs instead of Control and 24HPP.

Edited by user 26 January 2020 01:45:27(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

thanks 1 user thanked Fotz for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 28/01/2020(UTC)
perspexorange  
#11 Posted : 26 January 2020 02:33:13(UTC)
perspexorange

Rank: Member with Technique

Groups: Registered
Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC)
Posts: 944
Location: Shropshire, UK

Thanks: 206 times
Was thanked: 1218 time(s) in 941 post(s)
Originally Posted by: Fotz Go to Quoted Post
Well maybe i was a little harsh last night on Control.Was a bit drunk.I liked the film but not completely, there was some things not right about it i could never quite put my finger on but of course it's impossible for any film maker to completely get a film about a band or singer 100% accurately portrayed and hats off to Anton Corbijn for what he did with the JD story.Maybe it was some of the casting i didn't agree with, i mean i never felt Craig Parkinson was a great choice to play Tony Wilson.Always thought that was an odd choice but then who else could have done it.Sam Riley was a little too handsome and poster boy ish as Ian Curtis.The best bit of casting in any of the JD or Factory films is Paddy Considine as Rob Gretton in 24HPP.Brilliantly played by Paddy, spot on.


I think Grant Gee's doc captures Joy Division way better than Control in the same way Play At Home captures Factory way better than 24 Hour Party People. 'Joy Division' and Play At Home are both documentaries of course but if anyone asked me what would be a good watch to get the story of Joy Division and Factory i'd direct them to those 2 docs instead of Control and 24HPP.


I was a little drunk last night too. A very late night and I’m suffering this morning.

Totally agree about both those documentaries. I regularly sling on ‘Play At Home’ to watch (and not just to watch Ms Gilbert in... slow... motion... 😉). It’s a great, fun documentary and has some excellent Haçienda footage. I was pleased to see it listed on the leaked PC&L boxset and hope it makes the final selection. It wouldn’t seem right if it wasn’t included.

I loved Considine in 24HPP, but also really liked Kebbell in Control. Perhaps the character of the late, great Gretton just leant himself for great comedy performances.

thanks 1 user thanked perspexorange for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 28/01/2020(UTC)
Users browsing this topic
Guest
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Powered by YAF 2.1.1 | YAF © 2003-2020, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 1.214 seconds.