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Mr Discography  
#51 Posted : 15 September 2016 14:40:44(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
So, almost a definitive collection, bar 'The Perfect Kiss' being an alternate, incorrect single edit (again)


Recreated, but with an improved edit. Is that bad thing?

Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
But... The question is... should the definitive New Order 7" singles also include 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion', which was a single in the US, but not in the UK..? What do you think?


The nearest thing to a 7" edit was Morel's Pink Noise Radio mix. You could also argue for 'Hellbent', being that it was a promo single for 'Total'.

Also, if GIAUE should be there, so should 'Someone Like You' (also a remix only release).

Where does it end?


'Perfect Kiss' isn't improved, due to the 'wobble' at 0:02. And it's not either of the two original 7" mixes. 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.

The album version of 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion' was the lead track on its US single release, so that is the single mix as well. 'Someone Like You' was a single, but twelve inch only with solely DJ remixes, and nothing close to a single mix - so not eligible for my own 'Singles' playlist.

Didn't want a song on more than once, so sticking with 'Blue Monday 1988' instead of the original 12', as that's the most commonly available "radio edit".
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ROCKET MICK on 16/09/2016(UTC)
negative1  
#52 Posted : 15 September 2016 22:50:06(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post

'Perfect Kiss' isn't improved, due to the 'wobble' at 0:02. And it's not either of the two original 7" mixes. 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.

The album version of 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion' was the lead track on its US single release, so that is the single mix as well. 'Someone Like You' was a single, but twelve inch only with solely DJ remixes, and nothing close to a single mix - so not eligible for my own 'Singles' playlist.

Didn't want a song on more than once, so sticking with 'Blue Monday 1988' instead of the original 12', as that's the most commonly available "radio edit".


the following were 7" promo edits, and only released that way:

6 Confusion (UK 7" Promo Edt) (2015 Remastered Version) 4:09 <- german 7" promo's were also released

7 Thieves Like Us (7" Promo Edit) (2015 Remastered Version) 3:56 <- with a promo edit of 'lonesome tonight' on the b-side

yes, of course they were full 12 inch singles, but the single versions were never released properly either.

later
-1

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ROCKET MICK on 16/09/2016(UTC)
Mr Discography  
#53 Posted : 16 September 2016 01:07:25(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: negative1 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post

'Perfect Kiss' isn't improved, due to the 'wobble' at 0:02. And it's not either of the two original 7" mixes. 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.

The album version of 'Guilt Is A Useless Emotion' was the lead track on its US single release, so that is the single mix as well. 'Someone Like You' was a single, but twelve inch only with solely DJ remixes, and nothing close to a single mix - so not eligible for my own 'Singles' playlist.

Didn't want a song on more than once, so sticking with 'Blue Monday 1988' instead of the original 12', as that's the most commonly available "radio edit".


the following were 7" promo edits, and only released that way:

6 Confusion (UK 7" Promo Edt) (2015 Remastered Version) 4:09 <- german 7" promo's were also released

7 Thieves Like Us (7" Promo Edit) (2015 Remastered Version) 3:56 <- with a promo edit of 'lonesome tonight' on the b-side

yes, of course they were full 12 inch singles, but the single versions were never released properly either.

later
-1



But they had accompanying single releases, unlike 'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You'. Hence their inclusion on' Singles' (and on my amended/corrected 'Singles' playlist).
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ROCKET MICK on 16/09/2016(UTC)
NotAMod  
#54 Posted : 17 September 2016 04:12:07(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.


For me 'Hellbent' was a more natural choice for the new Singles compilation over 'I'll Stay With You' purely because the latter is just the bog standard album version whereas the former was completely remixed into - arguably - a single/radio version back in 2011. 'Plastic' was simply the album mix, released as a 'key digital track' to promote the LP so I wouldn't have included it. Hellbent had at least two promo CDs so if this were the 90s or early naughties then it almost certainly would have been put out as a single to promote Total. Even the back of the UK Hellbent promo says "Single street date June 27th":

Hellbent
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Mr Discography  
#55 Posted : 17 September 2016 05:32:25(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: NotAMod Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.


For me 'Hellbent' was a more natural choice for the new Singles compilation over 'I'll Stay With You' purely because the latter is just the bog standard album version whereas the former was completely remixed into - arguably - a single/radio version back in 2011. 'Plastic' was simply the album mix, released as a 'key digital track' to promote the LP so I wouldn't have included it. Hellbent had at least two promo CDs so if this were the 90s or early naughties then it almost certainly would have been put out as a single to promote Total. Even the back of the UK Hellbent promo says "Single street date June 27th":

Hellbent


I only recall the one version of 'Hellbent' - where is the radio mix/edit available? What's is running time?
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Johnny James  
#56 Posted : 17 September 2016 05:43:39(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: NotAMod Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.


For me 'Hellbent' was a more natural choice for the new Singles compilation over 'I'll Stay With You' purely because the latter is just the bog standard album version whereas the former was completely remixed into - arguably - a single/radio version back in 2011. 'Plastic' was simply the album mix, released as a 'key digital track' to promote the LP so I wouldn't have included it. Hellbent had at least two promo CDs so if this were the 90s or early naughties then it almost certainly would have been put out as a single to promote Total. Even the back of the UK Hellbent promo says "Single street date June 27th":

Hellbent


I only recall the one version of 'Hellbent' - where is the radio mix/edit available? What's is running time?


It was lightly remixed for Total (and that 1 track CDR promo), it differs from the Lost Sirens mix.

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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Andy  
#57 Posted : 17 September 2016 06:13:10(UTC)
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Mr Discography  
#58 Posted : 17 September 2016 08:37:54(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: NotAMod Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
'Hellbent' and 'I'll Stay With You' had CD-R promos sent to stations to promote 'Total' and 'Lost Sirens', but didn't have dedicated single releases commercially available - so not counted as singles. Similar to 'Plastic', which was an instant grat from 'Music Complete', but not officially a single release.


For me 'Hellbent' was a more natural choice for the new Singles compilation over 'I'll Stay With You' purely because the latter is just the bog standard album version whereas the former was completely remixed into - arguably - a single/radio version back in 2011. 'Plastic' was simply the album mix, released as a 'key digital track' to promote the LP so I wouldn't have included it. Hellbent had at least two promo CDs so if this were the 90s or early naughties then it almost certainly would have been put out as a single to promote Total. Even the back of the UK Hellbent promo says "Single street date June 27th":

Hellbent


I only recall the one version of 'Hellbent' - where is the radio mix/edit available? What's is running time?


It was lightly remixed for Total (and that 1 track CDR promo), it differs from the Lost Sirens mix.



Really? I've never noticed any differences. What are they?
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
NotAMod  
#59 Posted : 17 September 2016 10:58:48(UTC)
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When Lost Sirens came out, Hellbent was appended (Original Mix) on some digital stores which piqued my interest and the press release at the time indicated "Hellbent will appear for the first time in its non-Radio Edit form" or something similar.

Regarding the actual Total (4:28) vs Lost Sirens (4:27) version differences...

Snare drum for a start, much beefier on the Total version. The Hooky bass on the Lost Sirens version is noticeably quieter as are some keyboard parts. On the Total version some of the guitar parts are also quieter in the mix. Overall the two just have different stereo images over headphones... on one mix the guitar is on the left and on the other the right etc. The easiest way to sum it up is that the Total version has a bit of a sheen whereas the LS version is a bit rougher'n'ready.

Edited by user 17 September 2016 10:59:53(UTC)  | Reason: Tidy.

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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Johnny James  
#60 Posted : 17 September 2016 11:55:59(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: NotAMod Go to Quoted Post
When Lost Sirens came out, Hellbent was appended (Original Mix) on some digital stores which piqued my interest and the press release at the time indicated "Hellbent will appear for the first time in its non-Radio Edit form" or something similar.

Regarding the actual Total (4:28) vs Lost Sirens (4:27) version differences...

Snare drum for a start, much beefier on the Total version. The Hooky bass on the Lost Sirens version is noticeably quieter as are some keyboard parts. On the Total version some of the guitar parts are also quieter in the mix. Overall the two just have different stereo images over headphones... on one mix the guitar is on the left and on the other the right etc. The easiest way to sum it up is that the Total version has a bit of a sheen whereas the LS version is a bit rougher'n'ready.


Extra production done by Jeremy Wheatley.
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Mr Discography  
#61 Posted : 18 September 2016 12:42:35(UTC)
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You learn something new every day... Never listened to both versions back to back before (until now). Think I prefer the 'Total' version.
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Ken Doherty  
#62 Posted : 19 September 2016 04:03:17(UTC)
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Saw the CD version on sale in Fopp at the weekend - £14? Is someone having a laugh? Seeing as the newest songs on it are over 10 years old, they shouldn't be charging more a tenner for it.
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
M1  
#63 Posted : 20 September 2016 04:40:42(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
I haven't received the CD from the New Order store yet, but 'Spooky' is the 'Republic' album version on the Spotify version of the remastered 'Singles', despite being labelled as the (Fluke) 'Minimix'. Is this the case on the LP/CD? Another tracklisting balls up?


After several emails back and forth with Warners and the people behind the vinylcollector site, I was finally able to access a digital download of Singles to complement the vinyl set. And yep, it's the 4:44 album version of Spooky (labelled as Minimix...) :(


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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Johnny James  
#64 Posted : 20 September 2016 05:20:06(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: M1 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
I haven't received the CD from the New Order store yet, but 'Spooky' is the 'Republic' album version on the Spotify version of the remastered 'Singles', despite being labelled as the (Fluke) 'Minimix'. Is this the case on the LP/CD? Another tracklisting balls up?


After several emails back and forth with Warners and the people behind the vinylcollector site, I was finally able to access a digital download of Singles to complement the vinyl set. And yep, it's the 4:44 album version of Spooky (labelled as Minimix...) :(




Tell them it's wrong, the CD and Vinyl have the Minimix

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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Ben  
#65 Posted : 20 September 2016 08:12:39(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: M1 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
I haven't received the CD from the New Order store yet, but 'Spooky' is the 'Republic' album version on the Spotify version of the remastered 'Singles', despite being labelled as the (Fluke) 'Minimix'. Is this the case on the LP/CD? Another tracklisting balls up?


After several emails back and forth with Warners and the people behind the vinylcollector site, I was finally able to access a digital download of Singles to complement the vinyl set. And yep, it's the 4:44 album version of Spooky (labelled as Minimix...) :(




Tell them it's wrong, the CD and Vinyl have the Minimix



iTunes (Belgium) has the real Minimix of Spooky Nod
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
morgan1098  
#66 Posted : 20 September 2016 13:18:45(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
You learn something new every day... Never listened to both versions back to back before (until now). Think I prefer the 'Total' version.


I prefer the Total version too. It has more synths and somehow the ending has an extra few bars, although I'm not sure how that's possible since the times are virtually identical.
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#67 Posted : 21 September 2016 01:18:43(UTC)
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On 28 February 2019, Dumb will release, 'Not Fucking AGAIN: New Order 1982 - 2016'. Dick Staines, spoked man for Fucking Thick, spouts, 'One of the songs will be from 1981, so fans will have something to talk about in the 4864 years till they can be arsed to do anything new, and the 976430985 years before they can be arsed to do anything new and worth two shits.' 'Perfect Kiss' will be marked '7"' but replaced with 'Sunrise' for no fucking reason whatsofuckingever, and Shit4Brains can reveal 3 songs will have a really annoying glitch on them, 'but we ain't decided which yet.' 'True Faith' will also be marked '7"' but replaced with 'Sunrise' for no fucking reason whatsofuckingever, and Dickie confirms: 'This is the second track marked '7"' but replaced with 'Sunrise' for no fucking reason whatsofuckingever.' You can buy it on limited edition vinyl, 43087458908644337906886985747365080897486390950808508508508508505808750854544444999097098600 copies only, which is also the cost of shipping.
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Jcp7  
#68 Posted : 21 September 2016 05:08:49(UTC)
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You must be mad.
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Debaser  
#69 Posted : 21 September 2016 06:50:09(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Hé Go to Quoted Post
You must be mad.


1.29 - 1.40


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negative1  
#70 Posted : 21 September 2016 08:51:15(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: morgan1098 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Mr Discography Go to Quoted Post
You learn something new every day... Never listened to both versions back to back before (until now). Think I prefer the 'Total' version.


I prefer the Total version too. It has more synths and somehow the ending has an extra few bars, although I'm not sure how that's possible since the times are virtually identical.


i compared the two versions in a wave editor, and the song shifts by one second, although the vocals stay in sync. then at the end the extra bars are added in.

later
-1

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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Michael Monkhouse  
#71 Posted : 22 September 2016 04:52:18(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Debaser Go to Quoted Post






People think I'm jolly beastly about New Order, but that's awfully unfair. I admire their indefatiguable skill in knocking out those hits - BM, TF / 1963, BM 88, TF 94, 1963 95, BM 95 - and ever-original slew of albums: Substance, Best Of, Rest Of, International, Retro, Singles, remasters, 'corrected' (but still shit) remasters, Total, '''''corrected''''' Singles rerelease... What's their secret? How do they do it? I guess we'll never know.
But the real reason we adore New Order is they Fearlessly put their JD past well and truly behind them. NEW Order, right? It's an inspiring message to us all: Forget the past. Look ahead, look on, NEVER look back. Hence:
First single JD covers 7", 12", rereleased 12", Record Day JD versions rerelease
Still JD compilation
Rereleased JD first Peel Session 12" 1, Peel session 2, comiled into Peel Sessions LP, rereleased LP in new cover, included in Complete BBC Sessions
Atmosphere 88, Substance 88
London reissues 93
93's 'NOSory' DVD, Radio 1 and MTV documentaries include JD
Love Will Tear Us Apart - 95, Permanent: Best of JD 95
Heart and Soul box set 97
Remastered Preston live, Bains Douches live, Fractured Box (Preston live and Bains Douches live), Re Fractured Box (including Preston live, Les Bains Douches live so Fractured Box)
CD remastered reissues
JD DVD interviews
Control OST
The Best Of 2008
Total: From JD to NO
+ / - singles box set
CD remastered reissues remastered on vinyl
NO played JD sporadically through the 80s and since 98 every gig has included at least three JD tracks (the Peel gig had nothing else).
Since 2009 Hook has toured JD all over the world and written his 'autobiography' only on JD...
It's a potent message: Look to the future guys. Never look back, and certainly don't make a millipenny out of it. RESPECT!
What an inspiring, endlessly self-recreating, AWESOME band.

Edited by user 27 September 2016 05:03:38(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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44rman  
#72 Posted : 29 September 2016 18:12:35(UTC)
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Hi, I just received my vinyl box set and i did not see a coupon for mp3 download. I've been reading that this does come with one, so maybe my box set was sent without it? I do remember getting a coupon for the Music complete vinyl set so i do know what the coupon looks like. I was hoping to avoid buying a digital copy of the album, since the vinyl was not cheap. I'm pretty sure i purchased a US version of box set (Warner Bros.) and I purchased it from SoundStageDirect Vinyl. Was i mistaken about the download code, or did i just get a box set without a coupon? thanks!
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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
M1  
#73 Posted : 01 October 2016 02:48:49(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: 44rman Go to Quoted Post
Hi, I just received my vinyl box set and i did not see a coupon for mp3 download. I've been reading that this does come with one, so maybe my box set was sent without it? I do remember getting a coupon for the Music complete vinyl set so i do know what the coupon looks like. I was hoping to avoid buying a digital copy of the album, since the vinyl was not cheap. I'm pretty sure i purchased a US version of box set (Warner Bros.) and I purchased it from SoundStageDirect Vinyl. Was i mistaken about the download code, or did i just get a box set without a coupon? thanks!


Mine came with one but it was useless. When they finally got back to me, one track was the wrong one (see above). I gave up and purloined a CD-Rip from elsewhere guilt-free and in higher res anyway

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ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
keepitcoming  
#74 Posted : 01 October 2016 20:53:51(UTC)
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I lost interest in the old new release of singles experience , but sirens 7 songs have a long lastingness that make me bored with stone roses, oasis, blur ,and pulp. Those 4 old fave bands playlist combined is now 5 songs fewer than the 7 sirens , so i am pleased they were found after they were lost . And I still enjoy hellbent twice , back to back, but it is the total version both times. Oh ,
,waterfall and adored are the 2 ,
Also of interest is that bad lieutenant, or is it leftenant, and electronic have more fun listening experiences than all the other hot bands of the 80's, and I say the same for hooky 's songs of revenge , and monaco and freebass- way way bigger playlist . Of course the bunnymen are excluded, primitives, sundays, and st. Etienne early songs also and a few other bands i can' t remember now. Also , How about that barny putting out an album called bad lieutenant , even though he could have called it new order, as Steve was there, and gillian probably came over a couple of times, But no, he knew There must be 3. He was smarter than anything ,but then hooky forgot 3 was really ok like when gillian was absent.he figured gillian would not care because he then made his lawyers make Barney and Steve and Gillian feel like 2. so, the other 2 and you was really steve Gillian , and bernard while he slept , and hooky probably .
Now is the time for new good hooky songs and new new order songs ,soon, and life is better. Meanwhile maybe i can find some more interesting xtc songs, as i forgot about them for awhile. Lastly , I love the Ryder Cup, but it hurts that Bernard is not as great a golfer as he is at singing ,guitaring ,song writing, and keyboarding /melodicaing . He and rory would be so cool, or henrik.I love henrik .
We're like kestrels
thanks 1 user thanked keepitcoming for this useful post.
ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
Jonathan  
#75 Posted : 10 October 2016 05:36:39(UTC)
Jonathan

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Self-indulgent post, sorry for the noise...

I'm a bit torn, I'd like to pick this up, I fondled a vinyl box today and it looks nice from what I could see (albeit sealed). The potentially missing and incorrect anyway download codes is a bit of a turn-off; it's marginally more than I'd like to spend, too, and would likely not see much play itself--- and when I think about it, I own all the first half on 7" and 12" already. Still,..hmm.

So over to CD-land, which is at least, the correct version of the songs in digital form. IMHO it's a bit of a shame that the CD packaging is so boring. Even a small touch like doing it a bit like "Complete Music" would be an improvement (I realise we're talking about separate record labels here).

Current thought is to focus my money-wasting elsewhere and wait for the CD to go down a bit.

Never mind NO, I did buy Complete Music, Shellshock 7", State of the Nation 7" last week, so all is not lost.

Edit: I do want to say though, that in terms of attention to detail on song selection, the fact they've bothered to revisit Singles at all, is all a great sign, and I think the people involved (inc Jonny) have done a great job from what I can see. Thanks for the efforts!

Edited by user 10 October 2016 05:43:48(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

thanks 2 users thanked Jonathan for this useful post.
Rorschach on 10/10/2016(UTC), ROCKET MICK on 20/10/2016(UTC)
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