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perspexorange  
#201 Posted : 29 October 2022 04:11:31(UTC)
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Incidentally, anyone (Johnny James, perhaps) know why the single version swapped the 'view without a room' to 'room without a view'?

I presume John Robie tried to cover up the rather sloppy (but charming) vocal performance in the remix.
Did he also make the decision to change the above line to make more sense?

I guess there's three possible scenarios:

A) they had already recorded two versions at the time of the LP and Robie used the alternate line in the remix;
B) they re-recorded the vocals (at least in part) at the time of the remix;
C) Robie spliced the lyrics from the LP version to swap ‘room’ and ‘view’ around.

I think C) seems unlikely and, with B), you'd think they'd've tidied up the vocal performance a bit better than they did (perhaps Bernard couldn't be arsed).


I am slightly bothered that they swapped them. I like the obtuseness of ‘view without a room’.

I wonder if there are versions sitting in the vaults that might partly explain what happened here. Maybe there's a second version, more akin to the LP version, with the 'view' / 'room' lyrics reversed.
Maybe it'll be on the box set? :-)


Still, Sub-Culture (despite Robie's interference) is an absolute gem.
thanks 3 users thanked perspexorange for this useful post.
Andy on 29/10/2022(UTC), Col72 on 29/10/2022(UTC), negative1 on 31/10/2022(UTC)
tapebias  
#202 Posted : 29 October 2022 11:53:22(UTC)
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I would offer Option D). Too messed up on drugs to notice. I can handle the LP version but can't listen to the 12". Too much cocaine/kitchen sink production IMO.
Wasn't there a bun fight with Robie and cakes thrown at him or was that a Hook myth? And Saville not liking it and refusing to design a sleeve?
Andy  
#203 Posted : 29 October 2022 14:34:03(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: tapebias Go to Quoted Post
I would offer Option D). Too messed up on drugs to notice. I can handle the LP version but can't listen to the 12". Too much cocaine/kitchen sink production IMO.
Wasn't there a bun fight with Robie and cakes thrown at him or was that a Hook myth? And Saville not liking it and refusing to design a sleeve?


According to Hooky in his New Order book, Barney suggested they sabotage Robie's chair during a recording session. Hooky didn't get along with him so Robie seemed to hold him primarily responsible. At the dinner during the premiere of Pretty in Pink, Robie shoved a mushroom vol-au-vent into Hooky's face in retaliation.

When questioned about the lack of a sleeve design for Sub-Culture sleeve, Saville has said he simply was never asked to provide a design. My theory is that there was probably much debate on whether to pull a second single from an album (when they'd never had even one previously). Robie was known for working quickly, but perhaps they were worried Saville's legendary tardiness would cause delays that could push the release too far out (it came 6 months after Low-Life as it was).

Johnny James  
#204 Posted : 29 October 2022 23:16:22(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post
Incidentally, anyone (Johnny James, perhaps) know why the single version swapped the 'view without a room' to 'room without a view'?

I presume John Robie tried to cover up the rather sloppy (but charming) vocal performance in the remix.
Did he also make the decision to change the above line to make more sense?

I guess there's three possible scenarios:

A) they had already recorded two versions at the time of the LP and Robie used the alternate line in the remix;
B) they re-recorded the vocals (at least in part) at the time of the remix;
C) Robie spliced the lyrics from the LP version to swap ‘room’ and ‘view’ around.

I think C) seems unlikely and, with B), you'd think they'd've tidied up the vocal performance a bit better than they did (perhaps Bernard couldn't be arsed).


I am slightly bothered that they swapped them. I like the obtuseness of ‘view without a room’.

I wonder if there are versions sitting in the vaults that might partly explain what happened here. Maybe there's a second version, more akin to the LP version, with the 'view' / 'room' lyrics reversed.
Maybe it'll be on the box set? :-)


Still, Sub-Culture (despite Robie's interference) is an absolute gem.


I've no idea. Remixers often use parts that weren't used as they might still reside on the multitrack. John Robie won't have noticed most likely, and the band probably didn't either.

thanks 1 user thanked Johnny James for this useful post.
negative1 on 31/10/2022(UTC)
perspexorange  
#205 Posted : 30 October 2022 01:39:18(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Johnny James Go to Quoted Post


I've no idea. Remixers often use parts that weren't used as they might still reside on the multitrack. John Robie won't have noticed most likely, and the band probably didn't either.




Thanks. It does seem kind of likely that there might’ve been various vocal takes and Robie either accidentally or deliberately used a different part.
perspexorange  
#206 Posted : 16 November 2022 06:31:26(UTC)
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Full-length version. 17:30.
I guess this answers the question as to whether the version on the new boxset is the 'newly uncovered' one that Hooky mentioned a couple of years back.
Presumably, it isn't.
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negative1 on 16/11/2022(UTC)
perspexorange  
#207 Posted : 16 November 2022 06:35:04(UTC)
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Kind of wish they'd played around with the images a bit. I think there were different photos used for the cassette, so would've been nice to see those used as well.
Debaser  
#208 Posted : 20 November 2022 01:52:19(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: perspexorange Go to Quoted Post


Full-length version. 17:30.
I guess this answers the question as to whether the version on the new boxset is the 'newly uncovered' one that Hooky mentioned a couple of years back.
Presumably, it isn't.


If I were a betting man I'd bet that either (a) he's talking balderdash or (b) it's something less finished/complete than this version.


TPK
Bernard:
Quote:
...was aided greatly by imbibing various pharmaceutical products


Not the first time he's said something like that. I remember back around the time of BM's release, he described it as a Pounds Shillings and Pence (LSD) track.

Edited by user 20 November 2022 02:03:31(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Debaser  
#209 Posted : 25 November 2022 06:09:39(UTC)
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thanks 1 user thanked Debaser for this useful post.
Like No Other on 25/11/2022(UTC)
Fotz  
#210 Posted : 25 November 2022 07:40:11(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Debaser Go to Quoted Post


"Up to 50% 0ff" Ha ha ha. Right. From what i can see, only 1(one) item has 50% off, the People On The High Line CD single. Very clever advertising.
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Like No Other on 25/11/2022(UTC)
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