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negative1		#126 Posted : 14 February 2021 08:45:19(UTC)
Rank: Member with Substance Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,185 Thanks: 927 times Was thanked: 1775 time(s) in 1187 post(s)		back in 2003, i posted these to ceremony: Code: from new order discography: Featuremist December 1982 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- CS: UK 1982 (Touch T01) Prime 5-8-6 (part 1) 6:50 Prime 5-8-6 (part 2)<-3 13:29 Touch Sampler 2 December 1996 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- CD: UK 1996 (Touch T_ZERO_2) 6:57 Prime 5-8-6 (part 2) worldinmotion.net --------------------- TOUCH FEATURE MIST Dec 4, 1982 UK 1982 ( Touchtapes T1)[with magazine] Prime 5.8.6. (pt 1) Prime 5.8.6. (pt 2) <-3 instrumental versions/jam based on 5.8.6. Cassette 61 minutes --------------- TOUCH SAMPLER January 1997 UK 1997 ( Touch T_ZERO_2 ) 6 : 57 Video 586 Various artists. Much ahead of its time, a 23 minute track recorded for the opening of the Hacienda in Manchester in 1982, and a blueprint for "Blue Monday": it was published in 2 parts on the first Touch release, Feature Mist. This is the missing middle section. neworderonline ------------------- UK Cassette (Touch T01) Track Song Band Version Time Notes Audio Video 1. 586 New Order Prime 5-8-6 (Part 1) ?:?? 13:29 2. 586 New Order Prime 5-8-6 (Part 3) 6:57 UK CD (Touch T_ZERO_2) Track Song Band Version Time Notes Audio Video 9. 586 New Order Prime 5-8-6 (Part 3) 6:57 Labeled "Video 586.3" Release Notes From Touch's website: "For the first time on CD - New Order's Video 586, a blue print for 'Blue Monday'" ---- A Factory Outing (Compilation) [Dec 1983] VHS: UK 1983 (Factory FACT 71) Prime 5-8-6 6:36 FACT 71 VARIOUS A Factory Outing Oct 83 VHS: UK 1983 (Factory FACT 71V) [PAL/NTSC] BETA: UK 1983 (Factory FACT 71B) 2:45 {Hacienda Construction Footage} * 6:37 NEW ORDER - Your Silent Face 3:09 JAMES - Stutter 3:03 STOCKHOLM MONSTERS - Life's Two Faces 4:36 52nd STREET - The Rapp 3:43 A CERTAIN RATIO - Back to the Start 3:08 A CERTAIN RATIO - Showcase 4:05 SWAMP CHILDREN - You've Got Me Beat 4:29 DURUTTI COLUMN - The Beggar 5:17 THE WAKE - Uniform 4:48 SECTION 25 - Warhead 5:47 QUANDO QUANGO - Go Exciting 3:06 {Hacienda Venue Footage} ** * Instrumental primitive of NEW ORDER - 5-8-6 (Prime 5-8-6) used for intro Hacienda construction footage. ** Instrumental mix of 52nd STREET - Cool As Ice used for outro Hacienda venue footage. - All tracks live at The Hacienda Club, Manchester. - The packaging says in big numerals "51" / "71", indicating the previous point (see also FAC 51). - Later releases on IKON with sticker stating: "Special Notice: Ikon regrets that The Wake and Quando Quango soundtracks have had to be removed due to insistance of Island Music Ltd." Click here to see a picture of FACT 71 later -1

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Fotz		#127 Posted : 14 February 2021 08:51:02(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 02/08/2014(UTC) Posts: 2,656 Location: Down on the farm Thanks: 677 times Was thanked: 3735 time(s) in 2657 post(s)		I didn’t hear that Haystack song till sometime around the mid 2000s.But yeah, I really like it.

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perspexorange		#128 Posted : 14 February 2021 08:53:18(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,378 Location: Salop Thanks: 504 times Was thanked: 3836 time(s) in 2376 post(s)		Cheers -1. I had a feeling that you posted this info before. Just as a matter of interest, have you ever tried to sync up the different versions to deftermine which bits of the 23 minute track have been used in each particular edit? Edited by user 14 February 2021 08:53:48(UTC) \| Reason: Not specified

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negative1		#129 Posted : 14 February 2021 08:55:50(UTC)
Rank: Member with Substance Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,185 Thanks: 927 times Was thanked: 1775 time(s) in 1187 post(s)		can't post text, sorry its spam: ceremony posts: later -1

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perspexorange		#130 Posted : 14 February 2021 08:56:53(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,378 Location: Salop Thanks: 504 times Was thanked: 3836 time(s) in 2376 post(s)		Originally Posted by: Fotz I didn’t hear that Haystack song till sometime around the mid 2000s.But yeah, I really like it. It's a fine little song, and I really like Hewick's vocals. I find myself singing it, without intention, quite frequently.

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perspexorange		#131 Posted : 14 February 2021 08:59:43(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,378 Location: Salop Thanks: 504 times Was thanked: 3836 time(s) in 2376 post(s)		Originally Posted by: negative1 can't post text, sorry its spam: ceremony posts: later -1 Ah, cool! I'll give them a look. It might be worth revisiting, now we have a new edit (the 'easter egg' on the recent DVD).

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negative1		#132 Posted : 14 February 2021 09:00:49(UTC)
Rank: Member with Substance Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,185 Thanks: 927 times Was thanked: 1775 time(s) in 1187 post(s)		ceremony post references: https://www.monkey.org/~...emony/digests/v2003.n017 https://www.monkey.org/~...emony/digests/v2003.n020 later -1

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negative1		#133 Posted : 14 February 2021 09:21:52(UTC)
Rank: Member with Substance Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,185 Thanks: 927 times Was thanked: 1775 time(s) in 1187 post(s)		Originally Posted by: perspexorange I've got Video 5-8-6 on the 'Touch Sampler', the 'Twice As Nice' CD, the 'Be Music Presents New Order CD' and the standalone 12"/CD from Touch. The only thing I haven't got is the original 'Featuremist' tape (I do have a rip of this though). discogs shows 24 copies starting at US$8.00, a lot cheaper than what i got it for. later -1

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Mr. Disco		#134 Posted : 17 February 2021 14:43:33(UTC)
Rank: Member of the Republic Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 241 Location: Brazil Thanks: 1466 times Was thanked: 507 time(s) in 240 post(s)		Is this the only official release of the Rough Mix of Confusion on CD? It got edited on the original edition of Singles back in 2005 (another unique version, I suppose?) I also purchased the 2020 remaster of the 12"... are these supposed to come with some sort of digital download? I've failed to see any indication...
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perspexorange		#135 Posted : 17 February 2021 15:35:43(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,378 Location: Salop Thanks: 504 times Was thanked: 3836 time(s) in 2376 post(s)		Originally Posted by: Mr. Disco I also purchased the 2020 remaster of the 12"... are these supposed to come with some sort of digital download? I've failed to see any indication... Sadly, there were no download codes for these or any of the Movement related singles. I ended up buying FLACs as well as the 12”s. Bit annoying. It would’ve been nice to include a download code.

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Mr. Disco		#136 Posted : 17 February 2021 15:44:13(UTC)
Rank: Member of the Republic Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 241 Location: Brazil Thanks: 1466 times Was thanked: 507 time(s) in 240 post(s)		Are there official FLACs for sale? Where? I bought the 12" hoping for a download like Be a Rebel, just came to mind the Factory releases are not being reissued by Mute Records....
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negative1		#137 Posted : 17 February 2021 19:11:58(UTC)
Rank: Member with Substance Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,185 Thanks: 927 times Was thanked: 1775 time(s) in 1187 post(s)		there are so many remixes of 'touched by the hand of God', its hard to track them, 1) the original salvation versions 2) the arthur baker remixes 3) the 7 inches and edits 4) the best of biff and memphis 5) the hand of bias mix and probably more... so the German cd: https://www.discogs.com/...oundtrack/release/417642 Various ‎– Salvation! (Original Soundtrack) Label: Interphon ‎– IPCD 2022-36 Format: CD, Album Country: Europe Released: 1988 Genre: Electronic, Rock, Stage & Screen Style: Soundtrack, Country Rock, Downtempo, Synth-pop, Ambient Tracklist 1 –New Order Salvation Theme 2:14 2 –Jumpin' Jesus You Can't Blackmail Jesus 4:26 3 –Cabaret Voltaire Twanky Party 4:17 4 –New Order Touched By The Hand Of God 5:02 5 –Dominique* Play The Beat 3:24 6 –The Hood Nightmare 1:54 7 –New Order Let's Go 3:44 8 –The Hood Salvation! Have You Said Your Prayers Today 4:10 9 –Arthur Baker Come On 2:45 10 –New Order Sputnik 2:31 11 –Cabaret Voltaire Jesus Saves 4:02 12 –New Order Skullcrusher 2:52 13 –Dominique* Destroy All Evil 3:33 Bonus Tracks: 14 –New Order Touched By The Hand Of God (Remix Version) 8:00 15 –The Hood Salvation! 6:13 16 –The Hood Salvation! (Nitro Dub) 12:11 Total Time: 1:11:18 and japanese CD of salvation had this full 8 minute version of the remix: https://www.discogs.com/...oundtrack/release/886400 Various ‎– Salvation! (Original Soundtrack) Label: Les Disques Du Crépuscule ‎– VDP-1345 Format: CD, Album, Remastered Country: Japan Released: 21 Jun 1988 Genre: Electronic, Rock Style: Alternative Rock, Art Rock, Downtempo, Synth-pop, Indie Rock TracklistShow Credits 1 –New Order Salvation Theme 2:15 2 –Jumpin' Jesus You Can't Blackmail Jesus 4:27 3 –Cabaret Voltaire Twanky Party 4:18 4 –New Order Touched By The Hand Of God 5:02 5 –Dominique* Play The Beat 3:24 6 –The Hood Nightmare 1:57 7 –New Order Let's Go 3:44 8 –The Hood Salvation! Have You Said Your Prayers Today 4:11 9 –Arthur Baker Come On 2:45 10 –New Order Sputnik 2:31 11 –Cabaret Voltaire Jesus Saves 4:02 12 –New Order Skullcrusher 2:52 13 –Dominique* Destroy All Evil 3:34 14 –New Order Touched By The Hand Of God (12") 8:01 Total Time: 53:03 as good as the 12 inch mix and dub are, this is superior for me: wish it had gotten a limited vinyl release. later -1 Edited by user 17 February 2021 19:20:50(UTC) \| Reason: Not specified

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Andy		#138 Posted : 17 February 2021 21:54:06(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 2,218 Location: Seaside, California Thanks: 1654 times Was thanked: 3335 time(s) in 2238 post(s)		Isn't it just Touched by the Hand of Dub with an extra 2 and half minutes or so at the beginning?
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perspexorange		#139 Posted : 18 February 2021 00:23:12(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,378 Location: Salop Thanks: 504 times Was thanked: 3836 time(s) in 2376 post(s)		Originally Posted by: Mr. Disco Are there official FLACs for sale? Where? I got mine here: https://www.qobuz.com/gb...New+order&i=boutique

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Fotz		#140 Posted : 18 February 2021 00:34:05(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 02/08/2014(UTC) Posts: 2,656 Location: Down on the farm Thanks: 677 times Was thanked: 3735 time(s) in 2657 post(s)		I have that Salvation CD.The version of TBTHOG is quite radically different , kind of a raw and live drum sound for a start. The 2020 Confusion remaster 12" did not come with a download code, none of the 2020 remastered 12" 's came with codes.

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Mr. Disco		#141 Posted : 18 February 2021 03:56:35(UTC)
Rank: Member of the Republic Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 241 Location: Brazil Thanks: 1466 times Was thanked: 507 time(s) in 240 post(s)		Touched is one of my favourite singles ever, and I love the rawer version on the soundtrack. That said, I only have the dutch CD. Never heard about the bonus track on the japanese release for many years. I have both UK and JP CD5. Confusion (1987 dub) is still exclusive to the UK CD single, no? The BIAS remix is also pretty good
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perspexorange		#142 Posted : 18 February 2021 04:49:18(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,378 Location: Salop Thanks: 504 times Was thanked: 3836 time(s) in 2376 post(s)		I have the Saville sleeve version of 'Salvation' (Canadian?) on CD, plus the European variant with the standard (terrible) film poster cover, but with the 8:00 exclusive remix. I got the former, of all places, in 'Our Price' in Stafford. I've no idea what it was doing there. Stafford isn't the biggest of towns and having a Canadian pressing there was just odd. I can't even remember if it was in the 'New Order' section or the soundtrack section. I just remember being very surprised by it, especially considering I didn't even know that Saville had done a cover for it. This would've been 1993ish. I've also got the cassette. I can pretty much pinpoint exactly when I got this; around November 1990. I was going to Manchester on the train one day and I picked up a copy of 'Record Collector' to read during my journey. This had part 2 of a New Order article (I'd bought part 1 the previous month). I remember reading about the 'Salvation!' soundtrack for the first time there. I then made it my mission to get a copy that day. I managed to track down the tape downstairs in HMV on Market Street, Manchester. Sadly, though, there was something wrong with side 2 of the tape. It had a really annoying buzz throughout; something that wasn't on side 1. I imagine that this must've been caused during the transfer and wonder if other tapes are blighted like mine. As regards the TBTHOG release itself, I definitely have the CD, but am pretty sure I have the 7" & 12" lurking somewhere in storage. Apart from occasional items that I'd purchase on a whim, I used to be quite specific in what I'd buy in respect of New Order. Initially, as I was always short of money, I just used to look for 'gaps' in my remix collection. For instance, if I already had the remixes contained on the 12" (e.g. on 'Substance'), I wouldn't buy the 12" (or not initially). For example, I would've bought the 12" remix of 'True Faith', but wouldn't've bought the standard 12" (as both tracks were on 'Substance'). Consequently, I have virtually every 7" of New Order but am missing some 12"s. In the case of 'TBTHOG', I'd have bought the CD (best quality format), the 7" (for the two 'edits') and the 12" (for the full-length version of the b-side). 'Touched By The Hand Of God' seems to get a bit of a bad rap with most New Order fans I know. Much like 'Confusion' and 'State Of The Nation', it seems like quite a few fans dislike it. Personally, I love it. Seen as if I got into the band when 'True Faith' was released, 'Touched...' seemed like more of that goodness that I had enjoyed on 'True Faith'.

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Michael Monkhouse		#143 Posted : 18 February 2021 05:47:24(UTC)
Rank: Guilty Partner Groups: Registered Joined: 03/06/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,998 Location: Rome Thanks: 61 times Was thanked: 2410 time(s) in 2004 post(s)		I had that Record Mirror two parter as well. My rule was all vinyl with other formats only if they had exclusives, but as I've said, Iost interest with London bullshit, practical issues and the Spice takeover. I got Salvation in a second hand shop in Cambridge in 1993. I remember cos I'd had one of my worst ever drinking binges the night before and it kind of made up for the hangover. Far prefer Baker's Touched, but I went through that on Denis' thread. Spice Girls forum. Some threads may be sticky.

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Fotz		#144 Posted : 18 February 2021 06:38:48(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 02/08/2014(UTC) Posts: 2,656 Location: Down on the farm Thanks: 677 times Was thanked: 3735 time(s) in 2657 post(s)		On the Salvation album, apart from the New Order tracks and the two Cabaret Voltaire tracks the rest of the music is possibly the worst music I’ve ever heard in my life. Utter garbage. As is the film from what I remember, I think I found it on YouTube once and tried to watch it and got maybe halfway through and just had enough.

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perspexorange		#145 Posted : 18 February 2021 08:05:16(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,378 Location: Salop Thanks: 504 times Was thanked: 3836 time(s) in 2376 post(s)		Originally Posted by: Fotz On the Salvation album, apart from the New Order tracks and the two Cabaret Voltaire tracks the rest of the music is possibly the worst music I’ve ever heard in my life. Utter garbage. As is the film from what I remember, I think I found it on YouTube once and tried to watch it and got maybe halfway through and just had enough. Thanks to a member on these forums, I was finally able to see the film 2-3 years ago. It is as bad as everyone says. Avoid! I'm grateful to the user that helped me out though. At least I can say I've seen it. By the way, I've often thought that, at least at one stage, 'Salvation Theme' and 'Sputnik' were different parts of the same piece of longer music (similar to the 'Peter Saville Soundtrack'). If I remember correctly, if you watch the film, certain bits of the soundtrack itself seems to contain elements of both tracks. I reckon that, at some point, the band (or even the film makers / record label) chopped it into pieces and called it by two separate names. Maybe to pad out the soundtrack; make it look like the band had recorded more pieces for the film. As possible evidence of this theory, on those 'Salvation Demos' that have been doing the rounds for years, one of the two versions of 'Salvation Theme' on them was actually labelled up as 'Sputnik'. That could possibly denote that the two pieces may have been edited from a longer piece, or that they had interchangeable names. Could just be mislabelling though, as well, I guess. I may be completely wrong here though. Just pure (and fun!) speculation on my part.

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negative1		#146 Posted : 18 February 2021 08:25:06(UTC)
Rank: Member with Substance Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 1,185 Thanks: 927 times Was thanked: 1775 time(s) in 1187 post(s)		Originally Posted by: perspexorange Originally Posted by: Fotz On the Salvation album, apart from the New Order tracks and the two Cabaret Voltaire tracks the rest of the music is possibly the worst music I’ve ever heard in my life. Utter garbage. As is the film from what I remember, I think I found it on YouTube once and tried to watch it and got maybe halfway through and just had enough. Thanks to a member on these forums, I was finally able to see the film 2-3 years ago. It is as bad as everyone says. Avoid! I'm grateful to the user that helped me out though. At least I can say I've seen it. By the way, I've often thought that, at least at one stage, 'Salvation Theme' and 'Sputnik' were different parts of the same piece of longer music (similar to the 'Peter Saville Soundtrack'). If I remember correctly, if you watch the film, certain bits of the soundtrack itself seems to contain elements of both tracks. I reckon that, at some point, the band (or even the film makers / record label) chopped it into pieces and called it by two separate names. Maybe to pad out the soundtrack; make it look like the band had recorded more pieces for the film. As possible evidence of this theory, on those 'Salvation Demos' that have been doing the rounds for years, one of the two versions of 'Salvation Theme' on them was actually labelled up as 'Sputnik'. That could possibly denote that the two pieces may have been edited from a longer piece, or that they had interchangeable names. Could just be mislabelling though, as well, I guess. I may be completely wrong here though. Just pure (and fun!) speculation on my part. i enjoyed the film, but then again i like offbeat indie films and music, more than mainstream stuff. later -1

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perspexorange		#147 Posted : 18 February 2021 08:38:05(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,378 Location: Salop Thanks: 504 times Was thanked: 3836 time(s) in 2376 post(s)		Originally Posted by: negative1 i enjoyed the film, but then again i like offbeat indie films and music, more than mainstream stuff. later -1 Me too, but this film was just pretty bad, IMHO. I will say though that I like Stephen McHattie, so that, and the soundtrack, was the silver lining to an otherwise dreary cloud.

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perspexorange		#148 Posted : 18 February 2021 09:29:58(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 20/10/2013(UTC) Posts: 2,378 Location: Salop Thanks: 504 times Was thanked: 3836 time(s) in 2376 post(s)		I've also got this, which combines TBTHOG with BM1988. https://www.discogs.com/...nday-1988/release/191215 I'm not sure of my reasoning for buying this. I'm thinking that I might have bought it for the BM1988 Dub, which I possibly didn't have at the time (I got it later, after having bought both the 12" promo and the CDV).

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Fotz		#149 Posted : 18 February 2021 10:58:51(UTC)
Rank: Dead Soul Groups: Registered Joined: 02/08/2014(UTC) Posts: 2,656 Location: Down on the farm Thanks: 677 times Was thanked: 3735 time(s) in 2657 post(s)		Originally Posted by: perspexorange I've also got this, which combines TBTHOG with BM1988. https://www.discogs.com/...nday-1988/release/191215 I'm not sure of my reasoning for buying this. I'm thinking that I might have bought it for the BM1988 Dub, which I possibly didn't have at the time (I got it later, after having bought both the 12" promo and the CDV). Yes I have that BM Qwest 12” with TBTHOG and TBTHOD on the b side as well. But, isn’t Blue Monday 1988 Dub just the same as Beach Buggy? Haven’t played it in years but might have to dig it out if there’s a difference

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Mr. Disco		#150 Posted : 18 February 2021 11:44:03(UTC)
Rank: Member of the Republic Groups: Registered Joined: 24/04/2012(UTC) Posts: 241 Location: Brazil Thanks: 1466 times Was thanked: 507 time(s) in 240 post(s)		Originally Posted by: Fotz Yes I have that BM Qwest 12” with TBTHOG and TBTHOD on the b side as well. But, isn’t Blue Monday 1988 Dub just the same as Beach Buggy? Haven’t played it in years but might have to dig it out if there’s a difference Not the same.
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